Temperature ups and downs causing fish illness? - need your help

[Dave 54]

Hi Rose sorry not to have been around as weve been busy with the pond these last few days complicated by some sort of vomiting bug I've picked up I havent felt like being around because it floored me.
Your problem is columnaris disease with the high temperatures weve all been having it will result in rapid fish loss .
Flavobacterium Columnaris to give it its propper name will attack the skin in any areas of weakness in its early stages this type of infection can be identified by small white or yellow areas on your fish .
This as it worsens gives your fish the white hazy look you can see caused by exessive mucus production in its advanced stages areas of red appear on your fish if not treated then your fish as you have found will become listless and more than probably if treated will die because youv'e left things too late I'm sorry to say .
Low disolved oxygen levels , high ammonia and over stocking of the pond will make an attack of columnaris most likely .
Good husbandry of your pond (which your not doing) reading your original post and regular system maintenance and regular water changes (something we practice on a weekly basis) all will go towards to helping you in preventing an attack of this bacteria.
you need to take a swab and take it to the vet to have this bacteria identified and I suggest antibiotic feed along with a good strong bacteriacide however because you put salt in the water do not use Acriflavin
I only hope its not too late for any remaining fish you may have in the pond

Dave

 

[Dave 54]

That is not true. It is easy to get medicated fish food. They just dont sell it there and wanted to make a buck so they sold you what they had.

Oh how I wish that was true our side of the pond diesilplower, to get medicated fish feed we have to go to the vets in the UK , there arent that many fish vets over here either and the ones we have are expensive so you really need to have to prove to the vet you know what your talking about prior to seeing one (then sticking to them like glue for future medicated fish food needs) .
It can be mopre than a little embarasing for the vet when a koi owner knows more about treating koi and what with than he does.
Oh for a change to the rules to allow us over the counter medicated feeds

Dave

 

[Tula]

Rose,
Please don't think we're tired of your situation. I think we're all heartsick for you and want to help.
Dave, I'm sorry you've been ill, I was hoping you'd pop in on this thread with some advise.

I'm glad I got my new air pump set up...even if it is a bit forceful....the koi are getting used to it...and with the hot temps we're having, I'm glad for the added oxygen.

 

[R.Rose]

Dave, I had a similar illness a few years ago, never wish that on anyone I hope you are better. I got it from a family get together and almost everyone afterwards was ill for 3 days. I never threw up so violently and constantly and the other end too . It's cause is due to UMMMM. delicately now....Use of toilet and not washing hands or kids touching their dirty diapers.(i wash my hands but the infant was ill and likely came off his diapers and of course kids touch everything). Be sure to clean down your shopping carts from baby's bottoms. .... .

CometKeith, name is Roseann or Rose, I may have missed a step trying to posting the test results; I bought a kit and did my testing: PH is 8.0, Amonnia is .25, nitrate is 0, Phosphate is over 2 about a 3. repeated it 2 days later and same results. Ammonia could have been higher before the water change.

I think it is too late. 2 more dead...The last few fish are near the surface. Water is being pumped out of the 1800 ghr pump directly to the surface like putting on a garden hose full blast. gpumo durectkr I added areration, the pond is under a shady tree the water is cool. I think they will be gone by mroning.. Today was the last day of the treatment and tomorrow I was to give it a second dose with water change.
Whatever happens tomorrow for sure that pond will be totally cleaned. I am very nervous about adding new fish. Have doubts and dont want to kill anymore. I am afraid to net these in the pool with fresh dechlorinated water & aeration for shocking them like I did to the ones that died in the treated pool.

NEED ADVICE BEFORE I MOVE FORWARD
My plants. The water lily will be removed from the pot and rinsed bare rooted. I plan to soak it in the pool with the pond care solution to kill the nasties living on the plant. How many days?
I bought a new basket and will repot with pond soil that I bought.
The bog bean needs to be divided into 3 sections. I will do the same as the water lily. Plan on keeping only 2 sections.
The marsh marigold - will repot it with fresh soil and pot. I dont know if it can live without it's roots in soil. Suggestions on sanitizing it?
or just trash all of these plants?

After the pond is refilled maintanence wlll be done regularly.
If some fish survive the holding pool & their illness ..... correct me at any point.
Before they are placed in the pond.
Heavymetal and chlorination neutralizer* will be added along with the pond treatment and salt. Pond filter with UV light. Second pump, also 1800 gph flow,spewing water on the surface for aeration with The bubbler.
Then add the fish? The equipment will be cleaned to.
If the sick fish that seem well die in the pond and no more are alive....what treatment do I put in the pond to kill any trace of what killed the fish.
Then how do I tell when its safe to add new fish? I have frogs and tadpoles residents to consider. .

Now if all the fish are dead by tomorrow before being put into the pond. ...I dont want to become fearful of adding fish and never try again. The water is conditioned and pristine what else should I put into the water?
How long should I wait to add fish? How do I tell that it is safe to add them? They will be 3 inches and just 4 to start. sold in pairs
or wait until spring 2015 after spring pond starts up?. I feel like a newbee.

On a brighter note, my 2 monarch butterflies emerged from their pupas, a male and a female. Totally beautiful to watch their wings unfurl. I will release them later in the flower garden. Two years ago I raised and released 48.
I will watch for responses today because 6 am sharp tuesday I will start draining it and cleaning

 

[R.Rose]

Pictures to view aeration and shade.

Just took these and it is past noon. The tree keeps the pond cool. The close up is the hose shooting on the water surface and I think i may see another 2 fish dying. The netting and protection is in dis-array now.

 

[Carol Wilson]

Fish become ill when there is disturbance in the nutrient levels of pond water. So, its important to check the ammonia, nitrite and nitrate level.

 

[Dave 54]

Pictures to view aeration and shade.

Just took these and it is past noon. The tree keeps the pond cool. The close up is the hose shooting on the water surface and I think i may see another 2 fish dying. The netting and protection is in dis-array now. View attachment 72315 View attachment 72316 View attachment 72315 View attachment 72316

Rose what are you acctually treating for at the moment , you need to be treating for colomnaris, please clarify

Dave

 

[R.Rose]

Hello Dave, The salesman also recognized colomnaris and ICK and bacterial infection Gram positive. I put salt and TetraPond Pond Fish Treatment - from the bottle label: Treats parasites, bacteria & fungus.. I bought API Pima Fix - treats fungal infections on the body and Melafix treats bacterial infections. These are all natural prodicts from tea trees and West Indian Bay Trees.. I was treating for all three diseases. I filled up a kiddie pool and placed a pump blowing out water into it. Measured Melafix dosage precisely mixed well in pool, netted 2 slow moving fish and put them in it. I started draining my pond for the 20% water change and checked on the fish in the kid pool and they were dead within 6 minutes. I looked at one of the fish and blood was coming out of its mouth. Mu husband said it was a matter of time for it to die. I made 2 major mistakes, dirty pond and not discover the ill fish sooner. but this was the topper for me. So I stopped everything and yesterday I drained the pond. I have 7 fish left and they are in the kid pool with the bubbler and pump for aeration. I added 1 ml of ammonia neutralizer because the ammonia level was climbing beyond .25 in it. (It's 25 gallons). We totally cleaned it the pond. I hosed off the algae on the side walls to get the coating off of them. These fish have little of the fungus and a few have the red bacterial streaks. This morning they are still alive! My pond is filled up now and I am putting in TetraPond Fish treatment. The plants are still out and I am waiting for the UPS delivery of fresh pond planting media and new baskets. The plants will be thorough rinsed and no soil left on them.

Major problem 2 - My pressurized bio filter and UV light. Put in new ballast and it is not running the UV light.. The UV light only flickers jsame as with the original ballast. I will use the filter without the UV. I have a separate UV unit on order and it should arrive Monday. I cant afford a new Pressurized / UV filter this year.

Problem 3 - My husband's pressure water sprayer part broke and the replacement part didn't work. He bought new one to pressure spray rocks and clean my liner. There are gentle settings on it.. He was trying to make clean up easier for me..

My gut feeling right now says less is better. They have fresh water, and I am putting in the Tetra Pond Fish Treatment. My worry is acclimating them to water temperature. Pond is 67 degrees and the kid pool is 75 degrees.
If they were healthy I would just put them in. I think I will add 5 gallons of fresh cool water to the kid pool.

My pond is 1000 gallons not 800, with it empty I got in and measure it.

MY UPS delivery arrived. Going out to set up the pumps and filter.

 

[Tula]

I don't think you need to be in a hurry to place them back in the pond. I'd keep them in the kiddie pool a bit longer, easier to keep an eye on them and make sure they're healthy.

 

[R.Rose]

I placed them in the pond at 10 pm today. The ammonia level increased by evening, I tested at 8pm. It was at .25 this morning and I added ammonia lock as stated above. A fish died and got himself stuck between the bubbler and water pump providing aeration i didnt see him. I had all the fish 7 in the pond and then i discovered him. The temperature of the pond and kiddie pool was only 6 degrees different. All 7 were moving about and didn't appear sluggish or staying near the surface. They were speedy and hard to net.
Tomorrow I clean and re-pot the plants.

 

[CometKeith]

R. Rose, Sorry again for what you have gone through. I think the fact that you have cleaned the algae off the sides is going to make your pond have to cycle from the beginning because your pond is very low on beneficial bacteria (bb) and this will be a treacherous time. I would recommend to do daily testing of the water and do up to 10-15% water changes daily if necessary to keep your ammonia at zero. Also no feeding at all or very minimal feeding until the pond cycles. Some others here may have their own approach but this is what has worked for me when I have encountered high ammonia. Basically the ammonia is affecting the stress coat on your fish and when it is damaged they are susceptible to disease. When you eliminate the ammonia they have a chance to rebuild their stress coat. Also leaving your UV off for now is best. Algae is your friend now as it will utilize some of the excess ammonia and help control it. You will see tons of algae at ponds fish breeders have for that very reason.

 

[Dave 54]

Hello Dave, The salesman also recognized colomnaris and ICK and bacterial infection Gram positive. I put salt and TetraPond Pond Fish Treatment - from the bottle label: Treats parasites, bacteria & fungus.. I bought API Pima Fix - treats fungal infections on the body and Melafix treats bacterial infections. These are all natural prodicts from tea trees and West Indian Bay Trees.. I was treating for all three diseases. I filled up a kiddie pool and placed a pump blowing out water into it. Measured Melafix dosage precisely mixed well in pool, netted 2 slow moving fish and put them in it. I started draining my pond for the 20% water change and checked on the fish in the kid pool and they were dead within 6 minutes. I looked at one of the fish and blood was coming out of its mouth. Mu husband said it was a matter of time for it to die. I made 2 major mistakes, dirty pond and not discover the ill fish sooner. but this was the topper for me. So I stopped everything and yesterday I drained the pond. I have 7 fish left and they are in the kid pool with the bubbler and pump for aeration. I added 1 ml of ammonia neutralizer because the ammonia level was climbing beyond .25 in it. (It's 25 gallons). We totally cleaned it the pond. I hosed off the algae on the side walls to get the coating off of them. These fish have little of the fungus and a few have the red bacterial streaks. This morning they are still alive! My pond is filled up now and I am putting in TetraPond Fish treatment. The plants are still out and I am waiting for the UPS delivery of fresh pond planting media and new baskets. The plants will be thorough rinsed and no soil left on them.

Major problem 2 - My pressurized bio filter and UV light. Put in new ballast and it is not running the UV light.. The UV light only flickers jsame as with the original ballast. I will use the filter without the UV. I have a separate UV unit on order and it should arrive Monday. I cant afford a new Pressurized / UV filter this year.

Problem 3 - My husband's pressure water sprayer part broke and the replacement part didn't work. He bought new one to pressure spray rocks and clean my liner. There are gentle settings on it.. He was trying to make clean up easier for me..

My gut feeling right now says less is better. They have fresh water, and I am putting in the Tetra Pond Fish Treatment. My worry is acclimating them to water temperature. Pond is 67 degrees and the kid pool is 75 degrees.
If they were healthy I would just put them in. I think I will add 5 gallons of fresh cool water to the kid pool.

My pond is 1000 gallons not 800, with it empty I got in and measure it.

MY UPS delivery arrived. Going out to set up the pumps and filter.

As Ithought it was, so good for you Rose your on the right track with your treatment keep a close eye on thngs until they are back to normal and hopefully , just hopefully your going to be ok as from now.
All you have to do now is get the pond cycled again and bobs your uncle your back on track again

Dave

 

[Mmathis]

So sorry to hear you are having this problem -- I know you are devastated!

Normally, how much and how often do you feed them? I noticed at several points you said you gave them a tablespoon of food, but I assumed that you were feeding to see if you got a response from them and if they would eat. If it hasn't already been mentioned (I didn't read through all the posts...), you might want to stop feeding them for a while. They can survive on algae in the pond. Overfeeding is one contributor to poor water quality, and seems like a good place to start until you get this figured out.

 

[R.Rose]

Since I discovered the illnesses feeding was done for a fish count.and view the illnesses.
After I have my coffee will check out if they are alive in the fresh treated water. I will put a sprinkle of fish food in, if they are getting well a bit of food might help them.

MMATHIS - This is what I think happend. Dave is right it was neglect, the pond should have been cleaned out completely last year. In May the fish were active stirring up the muck, we had temperature swings, after a partial water change they all disappeared. I did not look to find them and spot disease sooner. When I tried to fix the problem the disease was advanced. Too Little too Late.

I read that fish have tiny stomachs and recommendations are one flake/crisp or pellet per inch of length. Sometimes we camp for 2 weeks in past years and they dont get fed. Their colors are more vivid in a pond when they can consume natural food. I never had a fish die from starvation. The pet stores tell me that a fish can go up to 7 days without eating.

Normally I feed them floating pellets. . I guess my fish numbered 2 dozen, no true count on the black comets because they are hard to see. . Mornings I would toss in 1/8 cup and they would gobble up the food and when it was gone another 1/8 cup. It would be eaten up within 5 minutes - a few pellets that got caught in the lily leaves were soften and consumed by the smaller fish. When Al gets home we sit by the pond to relax and another small portion is allowed so he can enjoy their swimming.

 

[Lisaebetten]

Here are 1.2 million results for medicated fish food....

https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=medicated fish food

Dude whats your deal? No need to be facetious with your number post!!! She stated she has had the pond for 30 years (!) and is having distressing time!!! You can support her without being a smart hind end.