New Koi Pond Change in plans

[Dave 54]

View attachment 69233Slowly but surely lol

Looking good my friend looking good
One question though my friend , if your constructing a pond with a bottom drain fixture it is supposed to be laid and cemented in place as the base of your pond first along with the pipework

Dave

 

[ZenZilla]

Did I read this right your pond is 7 ft deep wow talk about overkill .
A pond anything deeper than 5 ft deep is considered a waste of water in the koi world here in the UK , I recall reading something about it many moons ago that the fish simply dont use those extra few feet DoDad in your observations is this true?
sissy provided ZenZilla carefully insulates his pond 4 1/2 ft is plenty fine in reality its down to the sort of winter he gets .

Dave

Thanks Dave I am going to use 1/2" foam insulation board on the block walls and wrap the PVC also.

 

[Dave 54]

Thanks Dave I am going to use 1/2" foam insulation board on the block walls and wrap the PVC also.

Great to hear it my friend, have you managed to source any Policarbonate sheeting for the pond cover yet ?
I mention this as you may forget it until its too late in the season which is something you dont want to do


Dave

 

[sissy]

I have a friend who is a cop up in Dayton Ohio John Hemrick and have been up to visit him 2 winters in the 20+ years he has been there and there winters can be wicked .I told him from then on i would never visit in the winter again .Last time I was only supposed to be there 4 days and got stuck there almost 2 weeks because i drove from my parents house in Berwick PA

 

[Dave 54]

I have a friend who is a cop up in Dayton Ohio John Hemrick and have been up to visit him 2 winters in the 20+ years he has been there and there winters can be wicked .I told him from then on i would never visit in the winter again .Last time I was only supposed to be there 4 days and got stuck there almost 2 weeks because i drove from my parents house in Berwick PA

Brrr sounds very cold there sissy , this is why insulation is a must on a pond
So far our pond has withstood a prolonged period of -15c without the water getting bellow 7c thanx to the forethought of insulating everything and covering the pond with Policarbonate roofing

Dave

 

[sissy]

That is the only reason i like living here not as cold and i used 30lb felt first on my sides and bottom and then used the pond liner stuff and then the 45 mil pond liner .Here it seems moles are our biggest problem .They are after the grubs so I put milky spore down to kill the grubs so my pond hopefully does not get destroyed again .I insulated under and around my filters before i laid liner over it all this way even less problems with that .This past winter was the worst with the polar vortex ,it affected a lot of stuff .I thought the 2010 winter was bad here ,that was nothing compared to this past winter .Our average temp is 55 degrees .I thought we were going to have a mild winter because Christmas day it was 65 degrees .Fooled me

 

[ZenZilla]

Looking good my friend looking good
One question though my friend , if your constructing a pond with a bottom drain fixture it is supposed to be laid and cemented in place as the base of your pond first along with the pipework

Dave

Yes I have already dry fitted all bottom drain piping and I just did not want to risk stepping on it or getting concrete on it while were doing the block work considering it was almost $300 for the aereated one that I got. And I have an 80 pound bag of concrete with the fiberglass fibers heavy duty to put for the pond drain

 

[ZenZilla]

Brrr sounds very cold there sissy , this is why insulation is a must on a pond
So far our pond has withstood a prolonged period of -15c without the water getting bellow 7c thanx to the forethought of insulating everything and covering the pond with Policarbonate roofing

Dave

Yes I will have to look for this ASAP

 

[DoDad]

Did I read this right your pond is 7 ft deep wow talk about overkill .
A pond anything deeper than 5 ft deep is considered a waste of water in the koi world here in the UK , I recall reading something about it many moons ago that the fish simply dont use those extra few feet DoDad in your observations is this true?
sissy provided ZenZilla carefully insulates his pond 4 1/2 ft is plenty fine in reality its down to the sort of winter he gets .

Dave

My fish use every bit of the 7 feet. and the majority are 28" while a few are 30" +
I see them swimming at the bottom in winter rather than just laying there.
More fish die in ponds that have depth of less than 3 feet than 7

 

[Dave 54]

My fish use every bit of the 7 feet. and the majority are 28" while a few are 30" +
I see them swimming at the bottom in winter rather than just laying there.
More fish die in ponds that have depth of less than 3 feet than 7

I fully agree and a myth has been busted koi do use all levels our own pond is 4-4.5 feet deep and is very heavily insulated against winter temperatures

Dave

 

[DoDad]

I fully agree and a myth has been busted koi do use all levels our own pond is 4-4.5 feet deep and is very heavily insulated against winter temperatures

Dave

If you just want a nice, healthy home for your pets a 4'-6' depth is great. If your purpose is to raise massive koi deeper definitely works. At a Koi show I were admiring a Kohaku and MASSIVE Yamabuki I commented on the outstanding bodies of their Koi and the owner replied that their pond is 10' deep with heavy currents. A perfect environment for a body builder.
As to thermal layering/thermoclines, they do exist to varying degrees in different settings. ALL liquids and gases tend to establish temperature layers which change with environmental conditions. Go for a swim in a local lake during the heat of summer and you'll have a warm surface layer at the chest, a warm bottom layer at your feet, and a cool current flowing across your midsection. The cool currents across even a 1000 acre lake will maintain an even depth from end to end because the water laminates itself.
If we use pumps to create top to bottom circulation we disrupt the natural layering and thermoclines no longer are a factor. JNorth is right about northern climes needing added depth.

 

[Dave 54]

If you just want a nice, healthy home for your pets a 4'-6' depth is great. If your purpose is to raise massive koi deeper definitely works. At a Koi show I were admiring a Kohaku and MASSIVE Yamabuki I commented on the outstanding bodies of their Koi and the owner replied that their pond is 10' deep with heavy currents. A perfect environment for a body builder.
As to thermal layering/thermoclines, they do exist to varying degrees in different settings. ALL liquids and gases tend to establish temperature layers which change with environmental conditions. Go for a swim in a local lake during the heat of summer and you'll have a warm surface layer at the chest, a warm bottom layer at your feet, and a cool current flowing across your midsection. The cool currents across even a 1000 acre lake will maintain an even depth from end to end because the water laminates itself.
If we use pumps to create top to bottom circulation we disrupt the natural layering and thermoclines no longer are a factor. JNorth is right about northern climes needing added depth.

Thermal layers are known to me not through fish keeping but from my job in the Navy as a Leading seaman sonar submarine skippers know how to use these temperature varients to their advantage .
Tell me DoDad have you ever taken tempertures are varying depths during your winter months and if so whats the difference between the top of your pond and the deepest.?

Dave

 

[DoDad]

Just the top and bottom of the pond . The top water was 45F while the bottom was 51F degrees

 

[ZenZilla]

Well I just ordered this pump and leaf basket and will this setup work Dave my jets are different than the ones in that diagram but Will the pump pull from the skimmer and bottom drain then goto 55 gallon drum then UV then back to the tpr returns? Thanks FYI I switched to an external to make it easier to service and run everything.

 

[Dave 54]

Our setup has four filters the pump is situated after them all and it is more than capable of pumping the water through the system however what sized pipes are you using ?
Bottom drans normally take a 4" pipe and all pipes up to the third filter are 4" from the third filter to the barrel filter weve run two 2" pipes coming out of the barrel/bio filter we have a "2 pipe then the pump then the UV-C
So I would put no 4 where no 5 is .
However dont make the mistake we did for pump maintenance we have to block of the water coming in from the pond and block of the water coming from the filter if you put a valve either side of the pump you'll be able to isolate the pump for maintenance and not as we do loss much water doing so

Dave