Fish dead after treating pond with AlgoRem

[Dave 54]

Having worked in government regulated industries (medical and aviation) I know that seemingly vague terms like slightly and moderately do actually have definitions. Unfortunately, unless you read the actual government regulation you don't know what that definition is. In the US, the cfr (code of federal regulations literally fills a library and finding the applicable documents can take hours for the uninitiated to do. Why all of this is cloaked in ambiguous terms and well hidden definitions, only the government and their industry allies know for sure.
All of this aside, quick fixes are often the cause of more problems. Unless the nutrient levels in a pond are reduced, the algae will quickly return, and if the nutrient levels are reduced the algae will slowly disappear. If the nutrient levels hadn''t gotten out of balance in the first place, the algae wouldn't gotten out of hand. Partial water changes and competition for nutrients by higher plant forms can do a lot to keep algae under control. Not over stocking your pond can do even more.

Whilst I agree with most of what you say @Harvey Schneider you are not taking into consideration on the sighting of the pond i;e is the pond in direct sunlight , does it have cover, [our own pond is a formal UK koi pond which means it has no plants in it] .
Nor if the persons making these posts are novices or experianced fish keepers or have correctly read the instructions as to how to use AlgoRem.
Or even what feed they give their fish [for instance our own feed has 40% nutrients as with our own summer feed etc], we dont know what filtration they have on the pond if extra airstones were added at the start
It appears with two of these cases that instructions where not followed to the letter , the treatment was put in the pond at the wrong time of day it clearly states morning not afternoon or evening again this was in two cases the fish were not checked on it clearly states that they should have .
You yourself should know that we never stop learning in this hobby and sometimes through the early years mistakes can and are infact made.
As such all this has to be taken into consideration before we make asumptions

Dave

 

[Dave 54]

Try reading the other two cases :-

https://www.gardenpondforum.com/thr...-pond-12hrs-later-almost-all-fish-dead.19506/

https://www.gardenpondforum.com/threads/tetra-algorem-green-water.19491/

Dave

 

[Harvey Schneider]

Whilst I agree with most of what you say @Harvey Schneider you are not taking into consideration on the sighting of the pond i;e is the pond in direct sunlight , does it have cover, [our own pond is a formal UK koi pond which means it has no plants in it] .
Nor if the persons making these posts are novices or experianced fish keepers or have correctly read the instructions as to how to use AlgoRem.
Or even what feed they give their fish [for instance our own feed has 40% nutrients as with our own summer feed etc], we dont know what filtration they have on the pond if extra airstones were added at the start
It appears with two of these cases that instructions where not followed to the letter , the treatment was put in the pond at the wrong time of day it clearly states morning not afternoon or evening again this was in two cases the fish were not checked on it clearly states that they should have .
You yourself should know that we never stop learning in this hobby and sometimes through the early years mistakes can and are infact made.
As such all this has to be taken into consideration before we make asumptions

Dave

You are quite right. There are a lot of variables to be taken into account and as a result there are no hard a fast rules. Underlying principles are a good place to start.

 

[Meyer Jordan]

Having worked in government regulated industries (medical and aviation) I know that seemingly vague terms like slightly and moderately do actually have definitions. Unfortunately, unless you read the actual government regulation you don't know what that definition is. In the US, the cfr (code of federal regulations literally fills a library and finding the applicable documents can take hours for the uninitiated to do. Why all of this is cloaked in ambiguous terms and well hidden definitions, only the government and their industry allies know for sure.
All of this aside, quick fixes are often the cause of more problems. Unless the nutrient levels in a pond are reduced, the algae will quickly return, and if the nutrient levels are reduced the algae will slowly disappear. If the nutrient levels hadn''t gotten out of balance in the first place, the algae wouldn't gotten out of hand. Partial water changes and competition for nutrients by higher plant forms can do a lot to keep algae under control. Not over stocking your pond can do even more.

This is absolutely true, yet the MSDS for other products will contain specific language as in the MSDS for Phycomycin that crsublette posted a link to. A lot of the problem with the language and detail in a MSDS for a produce cn be traced back to the country of origin. Each country will have its own regulation concerning required content and detail of a product's MSDS. The MSDS from Tetra apparently originated in Germany where the term "slight" may have an entirely different meaning than in another country.
But all of that strays from the point that I am trying to make.That being that while many pond treatment products may or may not be (usually the former) ambiguous in their supplied information on the safety of a product as regards fish, they are totally lacking in providing any information or warnings for the safety of other creatures, micro-, meio- or macro- that may inhabit an eco-pond. All amphibians are quite sensitive to any chemical or pollutant introduced to a pond. Many species of zoo-plankton have a very low resistance to these same chemicals. In an eco-pond specie diversity and richness at the lower trophic levels is the key to biological stability. Negatively alter this balance and problems surely originate.
Bottom line, manufacturer's supply inadequate and incomplete information on the safety of their products as applied to aquatic creatures other than fish. This should change!

 

[Mmathis]

@Linda Schubert We haven't heard any more from you since your original post. How many fish did you lose and what was your water volume, filtration, etc?

 

[budgenator]

You would think that there would be an EPA registration number on AlgoRem that we could cross-reference to get more info; maybe I'll stop at PetSmart on the way home and see what I can sleuth out on google later.

 

[Rod]

Not being an expert , fish keeping but moved to the Isle of Man in 1999 where I bought a farmhouse with a large fishpond whi had a number of fish in it, some very mature (ghost Carp)? I have changed the water regularly and cleaned it out with no problems except the ovation die off in a small number of cases.
Last week the water was getting particularly green, so Igoogled it and came up with tetra pond algorem.
With no real instructions I read the dosage as being add 10ml to 200 ltres of pond water.
( I then peeled back the label as instructed to find there was nothing on the back of it.
I have since found if you peel it up from the bottom .....they do exist!!!
Logic told me to increase the amount to nearer the volume of my pond which I did and a few hour later the water was getting clear, by morning two large Carp were struggling and all were swimming to the top of the water struggling to breath.
Eventually most died. However I then started changing the water, and so far three have survived.
No where does it tell me how to introduce it into the pond, so the fish which have been around for over 20 years are no longer!
Makeing the instructions More easily found would have been very helpful.

 

[Magzire]

That stuff should be banned!
When i used it my pond it turned milky white for two days. Then all the crap clumped together.
Just buy a powerful UV and be done with it

 

[shijimol]

The container of AlgoRem that I purchased had NO instructions for use other than dosage - 50ml/1000 liters of pond water. I now have dead fish. All were mature koi. I am devastated and won't use this product again. There definitely needs to be clear instructions on the container.

I lost my fish's today... Will never recommend this product. Devastated

 

[j.w]

@shijimol
Sorry for your great loss. Most of us here try to stay far away from adding those chemicals to our ponds. Putting lots of plants in your pond can help w/algae issues. I know koi love to wreak havoc w/plants tho but maybe try some way to keep them away from the plants. I only have goldfish and they mostly behave around most of my plants.