Country Escape's 2nd pond - Goldfish only

[callingcolleen1]

CE, I am so sorry to hear that your big fish died, you have some beautiful fish I remember, I loved that big black fish you posted one time...
A long time ago I had lost half my fish back in the early 1990's, don't know for sure what happened, but I think it was those floating plants, that year the pond was very overgrown with too many floaters, and suddenly fish started dying off. Any plant can become overgrown and cover too much of the pond surface, and I found this year the hornwort was getting way too thick in the bottom pond and the fish were not moving very fast, and they were starting to hang at the water surface, not swimming fast, when they should be very active right now, so I knew to start pulling out the excess hornwort as it too can become a weed. If the fish are looking "sluggish" and moving slowly this time of the year, the oxygen may be too low.

 

[CountryEscape]

All the other fish that look healthy are swimming freely and all over the place. Just the few that looked less than normal, hanging around the lily leaves, were the ones I was concerned with. I lost only goldfish, no koi, so the big black koi, Shamu, is still alive and well in the koi pond. I do have a similar fish to Shamu in the goldfish pond, that I got from PondKid last year. I put him in the goldfish pond intending to sell/give him and 2 others away, but they are still there, and I've taking a liking to HER! It's marked very similar to Shamu, but different scale type. Shamu is scaleless, the other black one is scaled. Both have some red on their heads, white bellies, black bodies. I know Shamu is a male, and now this one is a female, so it will be next year before I feel confident to move fish from goldfish pond, but that one will get put back with the other koi.
I, too, thought of lack of oxygen, and that still may have been part of the problem. But, with at least 50% of the pond surface open, and lilies on the other part, no other plants except the ones that came over the bog edge, I don't think that was the problem, but learning as I go, so not ruling out anything. For the time being, all is well. We shall see what happens in the next week, as temps are supposed to get into the 90's and that could cause more problems. I have the air pump ready to plug in during the days, though.

 

[callingcolleen1]

Yes, use the air pump for sure just in case, as you never can have to much water movement when the temperature is hot. You may have had too many big fish, as they grow larger every year and the pond then tends to look smaller, and perhaps not enough water movement, good to do slow water changes too, just in case there was any environmental contamination from unforeseen sources.

 

[callingcolleen1]

I think I willbe making my top pond bigger this fall or early next spring, as my fish look so big now and the top ponds seems somehow smaller than before..... gets worse every year, as the fish grow, the pond appears smaller!

Will wait till water is colder to move the fish, as they will slow down and be easier to handle and move, as I have not moved the two big Koi for at least 15 years or so, and I have never moved such big fish, need to use a large soft pillow case I think....

 

[j.w]

Really hoping your problems are now over for you goldfish pond CE. You have gone through a rough time of it lately. Guess sometimes we just never know why. Lots of could be's but no for sure cause. Just do the best you can and try to make things good for our fishy friends.

 

[CountryEscape]

Well, this morning, after feeding, and the fish were all pretty much hanging out and not swimming fast, I did a fast head count .... OMG, I counted 43, so there are likely up to 50 fish in that pond! Good grief, I think I see my problem, although I have excellent filtration, no nitrates to speak of, crystal clear water (although I realize that does not mean it's totally safe), and plants galore. So, in a weird way, I'm hoping no babies will survive from this year, and have seen none in either pond so far. Hoping my numbers do not increase, and then next spring I MUST get in there and thin out the numbers. However, I must say there do not seem to be that many fish in that pond. It's about 2700 gallons, plus the bog (which I would guess would be another 1,000 gallons or so), so pretty sure the volume of water is ok for the numbers of fish. There are 3 koi that are about 8-12" long (they will be relocated to the koi pond this fall or in the spring when easier to catch and no plants), then the goldfish are mostly in the 4-5" range, maybe 1/4 of them are 4" or smaller, and about 6 that are 5-7" range. Counting inches, if I'm doing this right (12x3=36"; 6x7=42"; 32x5=160"), I have a total of 238 inches of goldfish. In 2700 gallons of open swimming water, is that too much? I know they will grow and become more inches, but I used the high end of the guessing of their sizes and numbers. I left out the koi, because they will be moved eventually.
And, forgot to turn on the air pump today, so will leave it on all night. I turn it off in the morning so I can feed the fish, otherwise too much movement, they can't see nor "catch" the food, then forgot to turn it back on. Days going to be close to 90 for the next week, so will leave it on except to feed for a while now.

 

[sissy]

I have a timer on my aerator and it only comes on at night because i figure that is when it is most needed when the plants are sucking up the oxygen,plus electric rates drop at night :cheerful: .You can tell in the morning most times if it is a lack of oxygen .I feed my fish even less when it is really hot .I know also there is medicated fish food .Time to give the gift that keeps on giving .Fish free sign .STOP HERE :cheerful:

 

[callingcolleen1]

Yes, the fish will run out of oxygen right at peak of dawn, cause your are right Sissy, some plants can suck the oxygen out at night.

 

[sissy]

I also looked online and some plants use up more than others and the size of the plant counts also .The sights I read also say submerged plants use more at night .

 

[CountryEscape]

Thanks, ladies. I don't have any submerged plants unless you call lilies submerged, part of them is under water. I have some parrots feather that are anchored in pots, but the green is all on the surface. I'm going to leave the aerator on 24/7 for the next week or so. I don't think it will cause any problems, may help, too!

 

[callingcolleen1]

But some plants can also smother pond too, so you have to be careful and keep them plants cut back as necessary. To many water Lilly pads, like pad on pad, can smother and overheat pond too, same with any crawling or trailing and floaters too. People don't realize that the fish grow larger every year and consume more oxygen, and require more open water surface, so the same old system sometimes requires an extra pumps and filters, and I find that even the hornwort can smother the pond too! This time of the year it grows way to fast!

 

[CountryEscape]

Yes, next year I have the lilies pegged that will stay, the rest are going to take a hike. I want only about 4 nice ones in each pond. Found out the pale blue that blooms 10" above the surface is a tropical, so will try my hand at keeping that one through the winter. Failed at the purple one and red one last year, darn it. Larkin gave me an idea to keep it in water, just trim back all but one or two leaf stems. Maybe set up the kiddie pool in the basement, put florescent light above it, since I have other plants that must come inside. Going to dry out the elephant ear and black taro. Canna and banana trees must come inside, but won't take them to the basement, too heavy. Put them in the spare bedroom east window does perfect for them.
I have a TON of parrots feather in my stream, totally covering it. Going to get more stones to redo the stream this fall, when everything dies, but for now, it wouldn't matter if there were stones on the edge at all anyhow, cause it doesn't show at all. Wondering if that has anything to do with the oxygen problem in the pond that the stream flows into, too. I did not have anything totally covering the stream last year, and wondered about everyone saying plants took control. Didn't happen my first year, but sure is in the second full year of plants! Now I realize how people have plants to get rid of! I'm slowly taking out all the penny wart from the koi pond bog. It's too small to have that plant in there, want only individual plants in that bog, as it's more viewable from the deck. Going to remove the rest of the cattails, too. I have a plant in there that someone gave me, not sure what it is, but sure is pretty! Here it is. Can anyone tell me what it is? At first I thought it was Obedience Plant, but pretty sure it's not. I think the Obedience plants I have are rough to touch, this one is smooth and soft. Flowers are way prettier on this plant, too.

Pretty sure I got this from either TMann, Larkin or Fishylove. :blueflower: One of them will know for sure ... I hope at least! Kept both of these plants when I gave away plants to my sister, as she has mostly shade and didn't want to "waste" them on her if they won't bloom. BTW, her idea of "full sun" is that the sun hits an area! I asked how many hours? 4 .... told her that's considered full SHADE! She said, "Oh ...." LOL

 

[sissy]

that is a pretty plant

 

[CometKeith]

Hi CE, Re fish bio-load versus pond size, You are about 10 gallons per inch. Recommended is 10-20 gallons per inch for the average pond so you are on the high side of bio-load. Also large fish like koi need way more water. These are just average ratios and obviously it can vary on other factors like quantity and type of plants in your pond that Colleen discussed above. The local koi club here recommends 100 gallons per inch for large fish. Obviously a really oxygenated pond with great filtration can handle more bio-load. I think your pond size is probably okay for 5-6 of your largest fish, but you will need to take the big koi out to keep the rest healthy.

 

[fishin4cars]

CE, You didn't get it from me, I've never seen that plant before, Very pretty and I wouldn't mind a start of it if you ever get small ones. I have a tree that has almost the same flower. But definitely a different plant. Can you get a pic where you can see the leaves of the plant as well. I am having a hard time getting a good look at the leaf with the Iris and other plant mixture. I got something from Addy that is close to it. I want to say touch me not was what I got from her but I honestly have forgotten. There are nowhere near as many flowers on a stem and they are spaced further apart. Wish I could help, But would love to know what it is.