Aerator and bottom heater?

[callingcolleen1]

You could try that, don't see why it would not work.... you could also put your 1500 watt heater on ice and it should burn the ice by morning? You get lots of ice there Wayne, I think you must be zone 1 or 2? At least here we get frequent Chinooks!

 

[Craig58]

The propane torch along with maybe a hose connected to hot water at the house? Depending on how long a run to the pond it is that might be worthless as far as temperature but the running water along with the torch might work. How about one of those portable salmander kerosene heaters they use a lot in construction? Maybe you coud borrow one of those and set it up in a place that you can blow the hot air onto the pond surface.

I think if you place the stock heater on the ice, it won't melt down because the element won't be close enough to the ice/water. As the ice melts there will be enough air flow that the heat might just rise away from the pond and it won't keep melting the ice. I don't know. It might. Also, these heaters are designed to be immersed in water. I'm not sure what will happen just sitting on ice. I know most aquarium heaters will quickly burn up if you take them out of the water for any amount of time. (been there, done that!).

This is why I always recommend a 1500W stock heater be placed on the surface before ice sets in. Then it can be plugged in when you need it to make a hole once in a while. In your area you might need two of them side by side!!!

Craig

 

[crsublette]

Haha, never thought of a propane torch. suppose ya could use a cutting torch too don't know if there would much residue from the propane or acetylene

 

[crsublette]

Wayne, how big is your aerator, how many lpm is it pushing??

 

[crsublette]

For more heater options, you could think about using one that is not regulate such as a bucket heater. Few pics below. Only thing is the heating element must be completely submerged in water otherwise it will burn up if it is exposed to air. The heating element is inside the round holey piece at the bottom. Then, connect it to a timer that only turns it on during the evening. There's also a 1500w unit as well.

 

[brandonsdad02]

When I worked construction we tried using a torch to melt ice. It left a black film on the ice and water.

 

[waynefrcan]

It's a pond master ap-100 9,000 lpm, good for 7500 - 10,000 gallon pond aeration. 2 aeration spots, with 12 inch micro bubble air stone on each.

 

[sissy]

crs you have it outside your pond in a bucket by the looks of it and do you have pond water going in there .really confused by the 2nd pic remember also with some of these the need a dedicated circuit if the pull a lot of power they will over heat the circuit and could cause a fire

 

[MitchM]

So it seems like the main benefit of a surface heater is to provide some water to air contact for gas exchange, which would prevent oxygen depletion. A surface heater won't provide any real heat to the pond as a whole.
A fresh air supply, then, beneath the ice surface, without a heater, should accomplish the same objective because the air pumped in will find it's way out, somewhere.
I would think that a heater at the bottom of the pond could slightly increase temperatures around the heater which would also increase oxygen depletion, which would be bad.
It sounds like there is a fine line between keeping the fish surviving on what oxygen is available for the winter and maintaining a temperature that the fish will survive at.
Another good reason to keep fish load low and decaying matter to a minimum in a still water winter pond.
In Colleens case, her system sounds more like a constantly moving water system where oxygen depletion isn't an issue plus with the size of her ponds, the heater she uses is able to provide a survivable temperature for her fish.
I'm not sure how practical that would be though in a larger pond system.

Does that sound about right?

I did find some portable dissolved oxygen meters: http://www.thepondre...ml#.ULJ5qIawXmN
Has anyone tried these?

 

[sissy]

I bought the kh heater from pet mountain after the 2010 winter and that floats or submerses

 

[Craig58]

The bucket heater looks like a great solution. Put it in a bucket of water, turn it on and let the heated bucket melt down and into the pond. Would have to keep an eye on it and tie a rope to it to make sure it doesn't fall through. You also want to melt the last half inch slowly as if the bucket crashes through the ice, the noise might freak out and stress the fish. Loud noises at this time can be fatal to the fish.

Craig

 

[crsublette]

crs you have it outside your pond in a bucket by the looks of it and do you have pond water going in there .really confused by the 2nd pic remember also with some of these the need a dedicated circuit if the pull a lot of power they will over heat the circuit and could cause a fire

Definitely have water going through the bucket. Mind you these are made to boil water in a plastic bucket. Over time though, if cold water does not pass the element, then the element will eventually distort the bucket. Ya can easily making a wire stand or something else that can prevent the shielding from touching the bucket sides. Wattage is the result of ampage times voltage. Only pull 1500 watts no more than the 1500 watt pond heater. Difference between the bucket heater and pond heater is the pond heater has a thermostate control to help save electricity. You can achieve the same by getting one of those thermostate outlet cubes or get a electrical timer capable of handling at least 14 amps. I think the typical house circuit can only pull 22amp or 28 amps (can't remember which) until the circuit trips. I would probably add any heater, even the 1500wat normal pond heaters, to their own circuit or a bigger circuit if possible when using multiple heaters.

Grr, I couldn't find the 1500 watt bucket heater. I was told there was one but I think it was hopeful thinking. The 1000 watt bucket heater 120volts so that's about 9 amps, might be a little higher if your voltage fluctuates much.

Yep, if putting the heater into a bucket, easily recirculate the water. I have also read of many puting these into skimmer boxes. Just be sure to properly raise it so the element shielding can not distort the skimmer walls, but not concern of this as long as water is passing by it.

 

[crsublette]

It sounds like there is a fine line between keeping the fish surviving on what oxygen is available for the winter and maintaining a temperature that the fish will survive at.
Another good reason to keep fish load low and decaying matter to a minimum in a still water winter pond.

BOD is already extremely low in water that is below 40 degrees. It would depend on if ya overstock the pond.

In Colleens case, her system sounds more like a constantly moving water system where oxygen depletion isn't an issue plus with the size of her ponds, the heater she uses is able to provide a survivable temperature for her fish.
I'm not sure how practical that would be though in a larger pond system.

Constant moving water ensure zero stratification thus consistent oxygen saturation. Diffusors will reduce stratification a bit, but the effectiveness of air diffusors water movement is related to how deep it is (i.e., deeper the more of a wider current it creates). Atmospheric pressure at the water surface area is where the majority of oxygen recharge occurs. Aerators help to add oxygen as well just not as well as thoroughly stiring the water with exposed surface area and really depends on how furious the lpm is. I am told oxygen reactors are the best way to inject O2 into water, but these use very powerful aerators.

 

[crsublette]

It's a pond master ap-100 9,000 lpm, good for 7500 - 10,000 gallon pond aeration. 2 aeration spots, with 12 inch micro bubble air stone on each.

Yeah, that's pretty intense. Problem I think is maximum enthalpy is being reached at the water's surface and the submersible pond heater apparently is too far from the surface to help. Try a floating heater. There are those convertible pond heaters that allow ya to attach and detach a floater to the heater.

 

[brandonsdad02]

You can achieve the same by getting one of those thermostate outlet cubes or get a electrical timer capable of handling at least 14 amps. I think the typical house circuit can only pull 22amp or 28 amps (can't remember which) until the circuit trips.

Any electrical breaker will trip at 80% of their rating...Its to protect the wiring in the house from overheating and causing a fire.