100 Gallon Balcony Pond Build Complete

[dieselplower]

I feel like I'm on solid ground saying you cannot predict the future. You may think your opinion, or guess, is an absolute certainty but I'm skeptical you're actually have that kind of power.
Yes, I'm sure you do indeed look forward to that day. You would be absolutely over the moon should anyone one fail at trying to do something difficult, something that takes a bit of learning, testing, trying, and effort. You can delight in your ignorance that thousands of people before you had to try many new things in order for you to have all the equipment and methods you use to keep your perfect pond. You think all that knowledge just fell out of the sky? People tried and failed many, many times to learn what we know today. Bummer you don't have a time machine so you could go back and laugh at all of them too. Dead fish are a hoot. You could feel so superior. What a glorious feeling.

People trying new things today is how we're going to know the things we'll be using tomorrow. Just because all learning has stopped completely for most people doesn't mean it has actually stopped.

There's a very old saying amongst serious Koi keepers..."You can keep Koi in a bathtub." It's an acknowledgement that anyone can become knowledgeable enough, and with enough experience, master Koi rearing. Even in a bathtub. That people can't understand this concept only reflects on their own abilities and willingness to learn.

Some good points Waterbug but let me give you an extreme example to help illustrate my point. If you wanted to fly to the Moon in a spaceship that you built, would you start from scratch, ask some questions, ignore all the advice you were given from people who have been building rockets for a couple dozen years, tell them they are wrong, and go on doing whatever you want or would you use the knowledge of the people who had been building rockets successfully for dozens of years? Yes, at some point people have to explore new horizons in order to make advance in technology etc but having a 100 gallon container pond isnt exactly breaking new ground. Wouldnt you think it would be prudent to listen to a group of experienced builders who all agree with each other?

 

[dieselplower]

Whoa a cold snap mid August killed all the Water Hyacinth but the Winters are mild eh? Freaky!

 

[Dave 54]

Mucky I applaud your care of tadpoles frogs are under great threat from Fungal disease in South America intoduced by mistake by scientists .
Here in the UK and Europe our frogs are dying in ever greater numbers from a virus that rots them away Live , no-one knows where it came from but it is decimating our frog population the finger is pointing to the American Bull frog as the culprit and as yet there is no cure to it .
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/wi...g-out-in-parts-of-Britain-due-to-disease.html

Toads Frogs and newts are fast loosing habitat here in the UK adding insult to injury for the frogs,Thankfully for the newts a huge and health population was found in an old brick works site and in other areas where they are not under threat

http://jncc.defra.gov.uk/protectedsites/sacselection/species.asp?FeatureIntCode=S1166

So keep up the good work

rgrds

Dave

 

[crsublette]

It is quite a reasonable statement to state there is a definite distinction between fish thriving and surviving, such as Dave's testimony expressed the difference quite well. Also, since I have follow Dave for sometime now, I bet Dave also had a few more caveats in his system that actually made it work!!

 

[Mucky_Waters]

Awesome video. Randy, you always bring the good stuff man. :blueflower:

Thanks Charles, you know I also always appreciate your contributions as well. :highfive:

Mucky I applaud your care of tadpoles frogs are under great threat from Fungal disease in South America intoduced by mistake by scientists .
Here in the UK and Europe our frogs are dying in ever greater numbers from a virus that rots them away Live , no-one knows where it came from but it is decimating our frog population the finger is pointing to the American Bull frog as the culprit and as yet there is no cure to it .
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/wi...g-out-in-parts-of-Britain-due-to-disease.html

Toads Frogs and newts are fast loosing habitat here in the UK adding insult to injury for the frogs,Thankfully for the newts a huge and health population was found in an old brick works site and in other areas where they are not under threat

http://jncc.defra.gov.uk/protectedsites/sacselection/species.asp?FeatureIntCode=S1166

So keep up the good work

rgrds

Dave

Thanks Dave, but don't give me too much credit, I've had some frog deaths, and I know of only one of my tadpoles (real tadpoles), that survived to become a frog. It's a relatively small pond, and turtles like eating tadpoles. :frown: I have yet to have any of my frogs lay eggs in the pond, something I'd really like to have happen, but I'm not sure it's even possible.
We have the same declining frog population here. Mostly I believe it's a mater of habitat, but there may be more to it then that. I've lived in the same area since I was a kid and use to spend my days hanging around local ponds catching turtles and frogs. Many of the ponds are gone, and the few that are left have no frogs in them anymore, not one. The frogs in my pond are from many miles away up in the mountains where things are still relatively untouched, but even there I noticed a huge decline in frog populations, perhaps 10% of what there use to be. I know of at least one habitat restoration area that was developed to help restore the frog population, but it's been years since I checked it out. The last time i was there I didn't spot any frogs. I should probably go check it out and see what's going on, it would make an interesting thread.

Edit: just to be clear, when I'm speaking of frogs I mean pond frogs that hang out in and around the water all day. We do still have tree frogs around everywhere, but they don't hang out in ponds, except when breeding.
Don't know about toads either, all I know is I haven't seen a toad in years.

 

[Dave 54]

"You can keep Koi in a bathtub.", in 27 years thats the first time wev'e ever heard that one.
There is a wise old sage who coined the Phrase "Become a keeper of water before becoming a keeper of koi",which is a very good principle when you look at it.
The only time we have ever heard of koi in a bath tub is the Magio or eating koi , better known as the Samuri or warrior fish.....why you ask ?
Its because it doesnt show pain when bits are carved from it live and eaten raw.
They celibrate their equivulent of your very own Thanks Giving something they have taken to their hearts.
Each to their own me thinks

rgrds

Dave

 

[slakker]

I can see how you can keep a koi in a bathtub... one possible way is to have a proper pond outside and cycle water in and out of the tub. I'm sure there are other techniques... but doing this way reminds me of a quote from Michael Crichton (and I'm paraphrasing)... "people are so focussed on whether they can do something but never stop to ask whether they should". :dunno:

 

[Dave 54]

No its a metafore its all down to decent ponds, pond design, good koi keeping routines.
Then feeding regimes correct stocking rates, maintenance, and numerous other factors.
All these come to play in developing koi to be their best, without them your koi will not get to their best potential forget any of these and quite simply it wont happen.
Stress, temperature fluctuations, over crowding all this will go against them bad maintenance irregular water changes etc, they all serve to weaken your koi to the point of illness disease and finally death.

rgrds

Dave

 

[JohnHuff]

More likely you do not see the dead ones since they are scooped out in the early morning before they are sold ...

This is so funny. I was browsing Reddit and came across this post!

http://imgur.com/r/pics/xirtyXE

It shows a pic of the dead fish scooped out in the morning!

 

[crsublette]

And that is exactly why, before I buy fish from any local fish store, including ma&pa joints, I ask when they get a new shipment or how long the fish been there and then try to buy the fish on the day they receive them. Although, we can not know how they were transported, but, at the least, this gives the buyer a chance of getting healthier, less stressed, fish that have not yet been infected by the death, of whatever was the cause, that lingers in those tanks.

 

[Dave 54]

Here in the UK we tend to go to koi dealers that we know and trust nowadays ,
A koi dealership tht has a bad track record doesnt tend to last very long if they have that sort of die off, as word of mouth quickly goes around..
Not only that with the very tough and stringent UK animal welfare bill the government put into place a few years ago.
They would pretty soon feel the full weigth of the law would decend on them and they would be in court and out of business in short order.
Perhaps its time they put that in place in the US, any type of animal is covered by this bill if its sold its covered .
The onus is also on the pet owner where they have a duty of care for their animals, break this and the RSPCA would be able to have you arrested and in court in short order.to face a life ban of keeping pets and a hefty fine/possibly prison as well
Legisration currently being put through Parliament as an amendment to the dahgerous dogs act could well see the owner of a dangerous dog that injures or kills a person because of beng dangerously out of control (there has been a spate of children killed by such dogs these last few years) recieve a 10 year prison sentence..
So training of dogs is a must especially to the power dogs you see in that hands of thugs ( drug dealers gang members and the likes) who use them as a sort of badge of office within street gangs.
The last child to be killed was a 14 year old girl visiting a friends house and was set upon by 4 such dogs just a few months ago The last attack were a child was seriously injured was only last week.

rgrds

Dave
.

 

[Mucky_Waters]

Here in the UK we tend to go to koi dealers that we know and trust nowadays ,
A koi dealership tht has a bad track record doesnt tend to last very long if they have that sort of die off, as word of mouth quickly goes around..
Not only that with the very tough and stringent UK animal welfare bill the government put into place a few years ago.
They would pretty soon feel the full weigth of the law would decend on them and they would be in court and out of business in short order.
Perhaps its time they put that in place in the US, any type of animal is covered by this bill if its sold its covered .
The onus is also on the pet owner where they have a duty of care for their animals, break this and the RSPCA would be able to have you arrested and in court in short order.to face a life ban of keeping pets and a hefty fine/possibly prison as well
Legisration currently being put through Parliament as an amendment to the dahgerous dogs act could well see the owner of a dangerous dog that injures or kills a person because of beng dangerously out of control (there has been a spate of children killed by such dogs these last few years) recieve a 10 year prison sentence..
So training of dogs is a must especially to the power dogs you see in that hands of thugs ( drug dealers gang members and the likes) who use them as a sort of badge of office within street gangs.
The last child to be killed was a 14 year old girl visiting a friends house and was set upon by 4 such dogs just a few months ago The last attack were a child was seriously injured was only last week.

rgrds

Dave
.

Problem with pet care and protection laws the lines between pets, livestock, living decoration can easily get blurred. Even when it comes to cats and dogs in some parts of the world they are thought of as food as much as they are alarm systems or pets, and there are probably more fish kept in ponds for food then there are kept as pets. Lots of people care for, and love their pet insects and rodents, and yet lots of people raise insects and rodents to feed to other pets or creature kept for breeding purposes. You yourself know that big koi breeders often euthanize much of their unwanted stock. And when it comes to what creature deserve to be given special rights, you can't simple go by animal intelligence either, even if you did have an accurate way of measuring it, because many of the animals humans eat have rather high intelligence compared to many of the animals we choose to keep as pets. So deciding whether a plow horse deserves more rights then a pet mosquito can actually be a tricky thing.

Personally, I think there are far too many dogs and cats out there. I won't go into all the examples of improperly cared for cats and dogs just in my neighborhood alone, but I would have to say more then 50% of them shouldn't have pets at all for one reason or another. I'd like to see people have to get a special pet care licence before they can own a dog or a cat, just like you have to get a drivers licence before you can drive a car. This alone would help educate pet owners,and impress upon people the responsibility of being a pet owner, and vastly cut down on the number of feral animals and neglected pets in this world.
However, when it comes to people being harmed by animal under the care of other people, there should be no question of accountability. The owners should be held totally responsible as though they were the ones inflicting the harm themselves.

 

[dieselplower]

Problem with pet care and protection laws the lines between pets, livestock, living decoration can easily get blurred. Even when it comes to cats and dogs in some parts of the world they are thought of as food as much as they are alarm systems or pets, and there are probably more fish kept in ponds for food then there are kept as pets. Lots of people care for, and love their pet insects and rodents, and yet lots of people raise insects and rodents to feed to other pets or creature kept for breeding purposes. You yourself know that big koi breeders often euthanize much of their unwanted stock. And when it comes to what creature deserve to be given special rights, you can't simple go by animal intelligence either, even if you did have an accurate way of measuring it, because many of the animals humans eat have rather high intelligence compared to many of the animals we choose to keep as pets. So deciding whether a plow horse deserves more rights then a pet mosquito can actually be a tricky thing.

Personally, I think there are far too many dogs and cats out there. I won't go into all the examples of improperly cared for cats and dogs just in my neighborhood alone, but I would have to say more then 50% of them shouldn't have pets at all for one reason or another. I'd like to see people have to get a special pet care licence before they can own a dog or a cat, just like you have to get a drivers licence before you can drive a car. This alone would help educate pet owners,and impress upon people the responsibility of being a pet owner, and vastly cut down on the number of feral animals and neglected pets in this world.
However, when it comes to people being harmed by animal under the care of other people, there should be no question of accountability. The owners should be held totally responsible as though they were the ones inflicting the harm themselves.

Boy do I agree with this. I live in a subdivision and it seems most peoples idea of caring for their dog is to put up a fence or tie a long rope to a tree they can hook the dog to. In the morning they put the dog outside and let it bark all day until they get home. Then they say hi to it and go back inside for the rest of the day. I dont see what the point of even having the dog is.

 

[crsublette]

Problem with pet care and protection laws the lines between pets, livestock, living decoration can easily get blurred. Even when it comes to cats and dogs in some parts of the world they are thought of as food as much as they are alarm systems or pets, and there are probably more fish kept in ponds for food then there are kept as pets. Lots of people care for, and love their pet insects and rodents, and yet lots of people raise insects and rodents to feed to other pets or creature kept for breeding purposes. You yourself know that big koi breeders often euthanize much of their unwanted stock. And when it comes to what creature deserve to be given special rights, you can't simple go by animal intelligence either, even if you did have an accurate way of measuring it, because many of the animals humans eat have rather high intelligence compared to many of the animals we choose to keep as pets. So deciding whether a plow horse deserves more rights then a pet mosquito can actually be a tricky thing.

Personally, I think there are far too many dogs and cats out there. I won't go into all the examples of improperly cared for cats and dogs just in my neighborhood alone, but I would have to say more then 50% of them shouldn't have pets at all for one reason or another. I'd like to see people have to get a special pet care licence before they can own a dog or a cat, just like you have to get a drivers licence before you can drive a car. This alone would help educate pet owners,and impress upon people the responsibility of being a pet owner, and vastly cut down on the number of feral animals and neglected pets in this world.
However, when it comes to people being harmed by animal under the care of other people, there should be no question of accountability. The owners should be held totally responsible as though they were the ones inflicting the harm themselves.

Yeah, I pretty much agree with ya. Not gonna touch this subject, except for a brief moment.

I am totally against massive extension of animal protection laws. Sure, there is a place for them in regards to properly citing folk who intentional abuse them, but it seems too many folk want to blur the lines such as PETA by comparing chicken farmers to the nazis and I definitely do not want folk like PETA to get more authority under the law.

I try to keep farm cats. I "try" since my equipment headquarters is near a couple quite busy farm to market roads, I lose a occasional cat due to crawling into equipment and being transported to a field somewhere, and then I have coyotes and other wildlife out here. I like farm cats since they keep the rodent population under control and their cat food is cheaper than the constant poison I put out and there are many places where poison does not work. Also, the farm cats reproduce quite well. I always have at least a dozen cats and a few of them have been smart enough to stay around for quite a while.

For the farm cats, I have little raised and protected feeding stations and they come to my pond for water, but this is not good enough for some folk. When I go somewhere to try to find more farm cats, they ask all sorts of question in regards to proper shelter such as little sheds all over the place, additional security, and proper veterinarian care. Ugh, now, you are talking about hundreds upon hundreds to nearly thousands of dollars to keep farm cats to do what they have always traditionally done in the past!!!

I don't have much respect for these unreasonable pet advocates, by attempting to compare the animal to a human child. Don't give me this absurb nonesense of, " aren't we all animals? " I do support the mission of some of them such as sending money to a no-kill dog pound near me, that is since I want them to get better security and more cages due to their dang dogs keep on getting loose/escaping and come to terrorize my cats.

 

[JohnHuff]

PETA is the biggest killer of strays.

http://www.petakillsanimals.com/