New waterfall and stream build

[fishlips]

Thanks! I hadn't really considered a bog but I have read a little on them and it would be cool as I would like some aquatic plants (and crystal clear water!) What kind of flow rates can they handle? Enough for a decent stream? I do want more than a trickle

You did not consider a bog!! what was the black boxing and the end? I saw that a some kind of DIY aqua blocks.

I did not say "A lid and a lock to store the 2 year old" that sound like a good idea though. I will have to think on it.

As a koi keeper I see a pump before a sieve a bad idea think (poo smoothie) with no fish that perfect!!

Ohh!! the black boxes was a intake bay? for your leaf litter.

 

[Will130]

You did not consider a bog!! what was the black boxing and the end? I saw that a some kind of DIY aqua blocks.

I did not say "A lid and a lock to store the 2 year old" that sound like a good idea though. I will have to think on it.

As a koi keeper I see a pump before a sieve a bad idea think (poo smoothie) with no fish that perfect!!

Ohh!! the black boxes was a intake bay? for your leaf litter.

Sorry if its not clear. The "grid" at the end of the stream is where the aquablocks will go. I have found exactly the same product sold as "drainage modules" or "stormwater retention blocks" for about half the price you pay for branded aquablocks here. At the top of the waterfall there is a black box on the plan which is intended to be the spillway.

 

[Will130]

Im not ruling out any filtration at all but MANY build videos do not have any, other than the gravel over the reservoir I guess. Is it a risk to not include something with a pondless build?

 

[fishlips]

Ah reservoir and bog are about the something just different names.

 

[combatwombat]

Ah reservoir and bog are about the something just different names.

They’re typically different things. Bog is full of media to provide surface area for bio filtration. Reservoir is empty space for capturing as much water as possible.

 

[fishlips]

Ok, but if it is toped with rocks would that not be a down flow bog?

 

[addy1]

Welcome to the forum!

You have a beautiful area to build something.

 

[Will130]

Yeah I imagine a gravel filled reservoir is essentially the same thing but not really if you use aquablocks? I also imagine a raised bog or one at least at the beginning of the system is easier to clean!

Would the raised bog at the beginning still work well if you were only piping half or less of the water to the bottom of it and dumping the rest on top?

 

[fishlips]

They’re typically different things. Bog is full of media to provide surface area for bio filtration. Reservoir is empty space for capturing as much water as possible.

He was right they are differences a bog maxes bio where a reservoir max water held (plus your water in motion). I don't know why I did not understand that my brain was stuck in the bog guess.

The Pond Advisor sums it up nicely here. If you are planning a pond with fish later (when safe) may be adding it now might be better. May be you wont dirtied plants or your sweet angle drops a snack in the water. May be mid summer the water lever is low and very little gravel is wet. May be after the big game you and your buds are out having a laugh and someone adds water to your stream.

Adding bio mass to the tub you posted might be all you need for now just plan for what you will end with.

I don't know where I hear it but it stuck with me plan out the size of pond you like then double it. We all love to add something.

 

[Will130]

Hi guys, bit of an update and a couple questions!

I now have:

• 4750 GPH (18,000 LPH) pump
• 2 inch (50mm) flexible PVC tubing
• Bulkhead for spillway, non-return valve, ball valve for adjusting flow, hosetails, clamps, thread tape, etc
• Enough geotextile to cover the whole thing under and over the liner
• 1mm EPDM liner
• A heavy duty outdoor bin as a pump vault
• The tapered storage container I posted earlier as a spillway
• Expanding foam (standard) and some spray paint to hide it if needed (the black stuff is very pricey here)
• A bridge
• Loads of lava rock

The last thing I have to get is the structure for the reservoir. Aquablocks are pricey as here so I am thinking 2 plastic pallets, then some cinder block pillars, then 2 more plastic pallets. Could do all of that for like $40 or less. Thoughts?

 

[fishlips]

Maybe but the rating of the pallets is a factor. you can't use the over all rating it has to be calculated down to the foot print of the pillars. plastic is not ridge enough to evenly disperse the weight but more pillars would. Sorry for the math homework.

Only other thing is there are high pressure and low pressure one way valves or non-return valve. I prefer to just to drill a hole in the pipe 1/4in / 6 mm hole that will let in air if the pump stops. but still sprays where the water is going. but then again almost all of the water from you pump is "water in motion" how much is really added by getting a back feed or siphon from the spill way?

 

[Will130]

Thanks. The one way valve is this one: https://www.boat.net.nz/products/non-return-valve-inline?variant=22989746929749

Looks like a low pressure one to me as is for bilge pumps, etc.

The pallets I am looking at are 1 ton rated and 4x4 ft. Was thinking of doing 4 corner pillars and one in the centre. I am not planning on putting many large rocks over them, and I am using lava rock too which is fairly light comparatively?

 

[fishlips]

That one way valve looks like it based off a ball or some thing blocking the flow back. This some thing must also slow to volume of water. I did not see how much it adds to the Total Dynamic Head.

4x4 is 2304 square inch or little over 1 psi. Cinder blocks here are 8x8x16 going with the bigger side that's 128sq in (not hole side up) times that by 5 is 640 by the 1 psi is no more then 640 pounds of rock and blocks at 38lb per cinder block.

 

[Will130]

That one way valve looks like it based off a ball or some thing blocking the flow back. This some thing must also slow to volume of water. I did not see how much it adds to the Total Dynamic Head.

4x4 is 2304 square inch or little over 1 psi. Cinder blocks here are 8x8x16 going with the bigger side that's 128sq in (not hole side up) times that by 5 is 640 by the 1 psi is no more then 640 pounds of rock and blocks at 38lb per cinder block.

Thanks! The one way valve has a spring loaded disc in it, it it pretty easy to push but it also is a fair bit narrower than the 2 inch hose where the valve is. If it's not ideal I wont use it. How necessary is it to have a one way valve in a pondless waterfall? Does it matter if the water comes back down the pipe if the pump is quite deep?

Regarding the cinder blocks, I could get some more. Or I could just fill the whole reservoir with stacked pallets, but figured I'd get more void space if I used the blocks? Have attached a pic of the pallets I'm looking at and the cinder blocks I have. The pallets do have quite a lot of void space. Would the cinder blocks with the cross brace be best for extra strength? As mentioned I'm not going to add lots of large rocks but they will be covered by pebbles and some lava rocks.

 

[fishlips]

Aqua blocks support 5472lb per square foot your pallets are about 125lb per square foot so lots of big rock might be a problem. I keep looking at the 4 "thin" spots in the center thinking that is the weak points. If it fails rocks/children may fall in to your void space or held by the next one. I really don't know what would be best with or with out the blocks but limiting the amount of rocks to the load capacity I feel is the key to success

If this was my project I think I would not use cinder blocks and only just enough rocks to hide the pallets and have plenty of strength left for kids to jump/play in the water with out any fear of collapse.

Ask you self how much water will the value hold back will that amount of water be a problem flowing back? I Don't think so because a reservoir has to hold all the water of the feature when power is off.