New pond build and landscaping started

[GaryMoz]

YUP ITS BETER THAN nothing , and it gives you an easier option to fix if the water becomes a problem latter. They do sell flat drainage tile WHICH IS BY FAR BETTER BUT ITS THE SAME PRINCIPLE

I found this which does make sense

"As long as the water level inside the pond is higher than the water table outside then the liner will remain firmly against the sides and bottom of the pond.
If the water table gets higher then the liner will lift or bulge until the two levels are the same.
As the water table drops then the liner will go back."

My pond water level will always be higher than the water table, so I shouldn't have a problem

 

[GBBUDD]

I understand what they are telling you but take it from someone who purposely works with head pressure in drilling. What they are talking about is equal pressures. yOU ARE CORRECT YOU WILL HAVE A HALF AN ATMOSPHERE of head pressure over the ground table . which is a huge advantage to start with. How ever what they are not taking into consideration is static pressure. Ever see a artesian well where it is at or almost at the top of a hill? Water can be squeezed and thus added pressure can be built up. so say you have clay type soils or poorly draining soil and the water gets trapped under your pond. and additional water is squeezed/pushed to the same area this can equalize the pressure difference of your weight from your block and your water.
we will use a casing and level it out of the ground to drill in the presence of water adding the added weight you are talking about . increasing the atmospheric pressure. 75% of the time it works and then there is the other 25 % where we hit a aquifer and take my word for it half an atmosphere of pressure is not enough. not trying to scare you are say this is your situation. Only that there is exceptions to that rule

 

[GaryMoz]

I understand what they are telling you but take it from someone who purposely works with head pressure in drilling. What they are talking about is equal pressures. yOU ARE CORRECT YOU WILL HAVE A HALF AN ATMOSPHERE of head pressure over the ground table . which is a huge advantage to start with. How ever what they are not taking into consideration is static pressure. Ever see a artesian well where it is at or almost at the top of a hill? Water can be squeezed and thus added pressure can be built up. so say you have clay type soils or poorly draining soil and the water gets trapped under your pond. and additional water is squeezed/pushed to the same area this can equalize the pressure difference of your weight from your block and your water.
we will use a casing and level it out of the ground to drill in the presence of water adding the added weight you are talking about . increasing the atmospheric pressure. 75% of the time it works and then there is the other 25 % where we hit a aquifer and take my word for it half an atmosphere of pressure is not enough. not trying to scare you are say this is your situation. Only that there is exceptions to that rule

Ok, I hear what you you say. I think I have a simple solution.

The low point for the pond will be around the bottom drains and pipes are, these will be in a trench encased in pea gravel.

So at one end I could put pipe in that goes to ground surface, or even just leave a channel to surface filled with gravel. So in theory the water gathering around the bd and pipes in the gravel can escape go up the pipe or the gravel channel to open air.

I could even run land drain pipe the foundations and back to the gravel channel.

Do you think that will work?










o

 

[GBBUDD]

Ok, I hear what you you say. I think I have a simple solution.

View attachment 162158

The low point for the pond will be around the bottom drains and pipes are, these will be in a trench encased in pea gravel.

So at one end I could put pipe in that goes to ground surface, or even just leave a channel to surface filled with gravel. So in theory the water gathering around the bd and pipes in the gravel can escape go up the pipe or the gravel channel to open air.

I could even run land drain pipe the foundations and back to the gravel channel.

Do you think that will work?

yeah if your having a trench already with gravel adding a pipe just for drainage in that most certainly would work and work well.

For the couple bucks in pipe its a cheap insurance policy if you did get a build up in pressure. Again im not saying this is your situation but in high water tables its a mistake not putting in the bones to prevent a permanent fixture from failure.

 

[GaryMoz]

The hole is getting bigger . I've had to change design slightly as we are nearer the Yew tree than I expected.

 

[GBBUDD]

Mature plantings go along way in making it homey

 

[GaryMoz]

The pond is the large front section with a trench for the bottom drain and pipes. In the background is the bog filter area, the wall for the filter will raise above ground level by 2'.

We will be laying more concrete foundations today and then starting the block work in part of the pond.

 

[GaryMoz]

The first blocks for the pond area are in.

I'm hoping by the end of next week all the blockwork for pond, bog filter and pump room will be done

 

[GBBUDD]

Love this part ! Love watching it come together.

Seeing all the water I hope you have decided to do something with underpond drainage.

One question how long will it take the water to drain into the soil from your trench and how deep is it ? I believe last it was talked about you seemed to be leaning toward a drain under the pond

Your going to be a meter below grade for the pond ?

I'm curious why on that side of the pond solid block is preferred over cinderblocks and rebar. ? Just not needed your ground does not heave much ?

 

[GaryMoz]

Love this part ! Love watching it come together.

Seeing all the water I hope you have decided to do something with underpond drainage.

One question how long will it take the water to drain into the soil from your trench and how deep is it ? I believe last it was talked about you seemed to be leaning toward a drain under the pond

Your going to be a meter below grade for the pond ?

I'm curious why on that side of the pond solid block is preferred over cinderblocks and rebar. ? Just not needed your ground does not heave much ?

Yes that trench is the BDs and pipe will go, it will be filled with pea gravel and at the right will be a channel of pea gravel coming up to ground surface, this will hopefully give a way any excess water pressure to escape. The top of the pea gravel channel will be around 500mm below water level, in theory any excess water should will just escape into the flower bed.

 

[GaryMoz]

Latest update on pond build, The block work is going on well.

I just started on the pipe work, but made a really stupid mistake, having dry fitted pipe and a 3" reducer to bottom drain and then for some reason when I went to solvent weld together I flipped the reducer the wrong way round. Then tried to quickly get it out it and ended up breaking the bottom drain , so a replacement is on the way.

All the block work should be done by the end of the week.

 

[GBBUDD]

Latest update on pond build, The block work is going on well.

I just started on the pipe work, but made a really stupid mistake, having dry fitted pipe and a 3" reducer to bottom drain and then for some reason when I went to solvent weld together I flipped the reducer the wrong way round. Then tried to quickly get it out it and ended up breaking the bottom drain , so a replacement is on the way.

All the block work should be done by the end of the week.

You have been busy . looking good . will there be rebar from the walls to the floor/ slab? Were you doing the block or you hired someone ?
I'm having a hard time visualizing how you glued a reducer backwards. I will say the bog along with a nano bead filter is a crazy powerful combination. The bog is running wide open as always and the bead is running off 4000 gph or less and it always looked clear now the fish look like they are levitating.

 

[GaryMoz]

You have been busy . looking good . will there be rebar from the walls to the floor/ slab? Were you doing the block or you hired someone ?
I'm having a hard time visualizing how you glued a reducer backwards. I will say the bog along with a nano bead filter is a crazy powerful combination. The bog is running wide open as always and the bead is running off 4000 gph or less and it always looked clear now the fish look like they are levitating.

Regard rebar, I've got a team of (very) experience ground workers doing it, ones 74!, they just say there is no need for it, I've also spoken to a profession pond installer over here and he again has said there is no need for rebar. So no rebar, but the back of the blocks are being backfilled with pea gravel, which gives a lot of even support.

It's quite interesting how the "standard" build method changes around the world, like these guys would never dream of putting a pipe in the ground without is being on and backfilled with pea gravel, but in other parts of the world it rarely done.

I'm working on the pipework, it was just a bush fitting, but it has a little lip for a pipe stop, so i manged to flip it over without realising it, so the stop was at the wrong end. I should have just cut the stop off and all would have been good, but I was stupid.

 

[GBBUDD]

Regard rebar, I've got a team of (very) experience ground workers doing it, ones 74!, they just say there is no need for it, I've also spoken to a profession pond installer over here and he again has said there is no need for rebar. So no rebar, but the back of the blocks are being backfilled with pea gravel, which gives a lot of even support.

It's quite interesting how the "standard" build method changes around the world, like these guys would never dream of putting a pipe in the ground without is being on and backfilled with pea gravel, but in other parts of the world it rarely done.

I'm working on the pipework, it was just a bush fitting, but it has a little lip for a pipe stop, so i manged to flip it over without realising it, so the stop was at the wrong end. I should have just cut the stop off and all would have been good, but I was stupid.

the best teacher is our own mistakes lesson learned no biggie, now if you had a 4 inch ball valve for 450 dollars and you stripped the union that could hurt just a wee bit.

trust me i get the tricks of the trade in areas . And myself fully agreed no pipe gets buried with out stone or sand unless the native is comparable.

peastone on the back side however would not be one of those trick for an area id follow here but i suppose if you back fill and compact at the same time i guess i get the design criteria. Myself i over build ii Hate pulling apart my work its a mother to tear down.

 

[GaryMoz]

Myself i over build ii Hate pulling apart my work its a mother to tear down.

Generally I always over engineer. But when you discuss things with local people with tons of experience and they say do it a certain way, you listen to them.

Having said that, they say the repaired bottom drain will stand up and be ok, but for a relatively small amount i rather not risk it and get another one.