Multi bay and plant filter combined?

[addy1]

Hi all, first post here.

I have a 50 cubic meter pond with some koi on it, and I intend to improve the filtration (mostly done by plants now). I intend to add 10 or so containers of 100 Liter each, with a vortex or ultrasieve before them.

Now these containers (for lack of better word) will be in sight and I thought, why not make them look and work better by adding some plants? Here is what I was thinking:



(click for full size).

I was thinking of doing a few of those with floating plants, and some with marsh plants (hope thats the right english word). The ones with marsh plants, Id make the drain lower and leave room for a finer substrate.

Is there a reason why no one seems to be doing this?

Also, assuming this isnt a terrible idea, any suggestions on what plants I could use for such a setup, and what to use as substrate? This filter will be placed in a light spot, but not much direct sunlight.

Any tips, comments or suggestions are welcome before I do something stupid (which I fear as I cant seem to find anyone doing something similar).

Cheers,

Vertigo.

The second filter, use pea gravel in it, with the up flow of water though it like you have shown. The bull rush, lilies and other do fine in a slightly shaded area. Cardinal flower, hosta, astilbe

Here is a link to a place i buy my wildflower seeds, http://www.americanmeadows.com/[email protected]&utm_campaign=2011-04-08+16:30:00, and a list of shade tolerant plants you could put in your second pea gravel filter. The main thing you want is the gravel to be higher than the water by an inch or so, or have the plants on little mounds of gravel. Most of them like their crowns dry and wet feet. You get your best filtration if the water has to work through the pea gravel and roots to get back to the pond.

Have the pvc go all the way under the pea gravel with slots cut into it, we cut 1/3 the way through the pipe, have the cuts facing down. Just a piece of pvc with a ball valve on it works great.

The first filter you could use the irrigation hose etc to make it a bio type filter.. It would be a little easier to handle than the lava rock.

According to some pond sites, a bog type filter if big enough is all you need, 10% of pond surface volume some say or 10% of pond volume. The more your fish load is the higher the % of volume you would want. Most true bog filters do not have prefilters, you want the junk to feed the plants.

 

[vertigo72]

update. Yesterday my new pump arrived. It was a 8000 liter/h pond pump (superfish or something) to replace my submersible pump which I dont think is designed for 24/24 operation (though coping with it fine for quite some time, perhaps because I put a timer on it to allow it some "sleep" time). I thought the submersible pump was also around 8K liter so I picked up a pump with similar volume as I didnt think my filter could cope with more, and I didnt want any less considering the volume of the pond.

When I turned it on, what used to be a violent torrent of water turned in to something closer to dripping. I thought the pump was defective, as it was clearly no where near as powerful as my old one. I decided to clock the time it took to fill my barrels, taking in to account the head, it turned out the new pump is pretty much inline with the specs, but the old one was 3-4x more powerful. Its at least a 25K liter model lol. No wonder my filter could only just cope with it.

Anyway, here is the kicker: my DIY vortex filter now really works, and works very very well with the vastly reduced flow. It didnt do much with the 20+K pump, barrel too small for that kind of volume, all the dirt was stirred up and never got a chance to settle.

I also found out the primary cause of the pond being so muddy. It really *is* mud. Previous owners filled lots and lots of baskets with "pond earth" for their plants, but the ground kept "disappearing". Now I have 100's of Kg of earth floating around a pond with no bottom drain and a water a change is out of the question for now.

So I plan on getting a 20K pump again, or adding 2 more 8K pumps, but making 3 vortex filters and putting them in parallel, then combining their outflow to the biological filters, as I dont think you can have too much flow for those, as long as they dont overflow. Any thoughts on that?

 

[addy1]

To help with the mud can you get a pond vac and vacuum some of it out?

 

[vertigo72]

I tried that last year, borrowing one from my neighbor, but I was less than impressed by it. Took ages to get like a handful of mud and half the time the thing was backflushing or whatever it does when its not sucking. Perhaps it will be more useful when there is far less mud in the pond, for the "finishing touches" so to say, but right now it seems like a waste of effort and my vortex seems to be catching more with zero effort. I just open the bottom drain every morning.

I do stirr the water thoroughly every evening now, I put the 25K pump on for an hour, just to circulate water in the pond, making the whole pond a huge vortex and turning it back into a brown mud pod with zero visibility, but that way the pump in the center/bottom sucks a LOT of dirt in to the vortex. Might take months of doing this before the water becomes anything like clear, but we seem to be moving in the right direction at least. Especially since water that has settled actually is pretty damn clear. Plants are also growing like mad, irisses are approaching one meter already (!) but its hard to say if that that is due to my biofilter or just the weather/season.

 

[addy1]

Probably both and I am sure that yucky mud you are stirring up has some benefits in it. Neat way to clean the pond, it will just take some time like you say, but the end product will be great.

 

[vertigo72]

I am sure that yucky mud you are stirring up has some benefits in it. Neat way to clean the pond,

I was actually fearing the opposite... as the slib layer is so thick at the bottom, I fear its full of anaerobic bacteria the fish may not like? Then again, I read Koi actually love mud (and are often actually bred in mudpools I read), and its gotta happen anyway. Perhaps best now the water is still cold.

 

[addy1]

With all the stirring up you are probably killing the anaerobic bacteria, maybe put is some real good air stones while you are working on it too. Add extra air. Yeah i have read the same, koi in mud ponds have great skin scales , and grow wonderfully.
Just watch your fish for signs of stress, also are you doing water tests? to make sure your levels are doing ok

 

[koiguy1969]

killing anaerobic bacteria is a good thing!!! its the aerobic bacteria that you want to save. anaerobic bacteria thrives in dirty "rich in organics"mucky conditions with low to no oxygen. aerobic bacteria colonizes oxygen rich waters on solid surfaces. it doesnt free float as some anaerobic does. loose dirt, organics, and debris are also breeding grounds for parasites, and disease causing bacteria. anaerobic bacteria is the bacteria that produces the rotten egg small due to noxious gases. hydrogen sulphide is one.

 

[vertigo72]

killing anaerobic bacteria is a good thing!!! its the aerobic bacteria that you want to save. anaerobic bacteria thrives in dirty "rich in organics"mucky conditions with low to no oxygen. aerobic bacteria colonizes oxygen rich waters on solid surfaces. it doesnt free float as some anaerobic does. loose dirt, organics, and debris are also breeding grounds for parasites, and disease causing bacteria. anaerobic bacteria is the bacteria that produces the rotten egg small due to noxious gases. hydrogen sulphide is one.

Yeah I agree. Thats why I said it had to happen anyway, Its just that stirring it all up is probably not going to make my fish happier or healthier until the muck is gone. While most of those anaerobic bacteria were more or less safely covered by a ton of mud, they will be all over the pond (and fish) now. Not sure how quickly they die (those bacteria that is)? Or is the just the gasses that those bacteria produce that are a threat? In that case, Im not causing a lot of extra harm I suppose.

As for parasites, the water is still only 8-9C (46-48F), which probably makes it a good time to do this, no? Although I suppose the other side of the story is that the fish arent in good shape yet either, coming out of a cold winter.

As for adding oxygen (or rather: air), Im currently blowing air in the first biofilter. I still have to buy a "real" airpump, so I attached an airstone to the aircompressor thats actually from an airbrush set I never used anyway. Its something like this one:
http://www.tradevv.com/chinasuppliers/wanghongchuan_p_1f2f2/china-Air-compressor-DU112.html

Rated at 27L/min. Thats guaranteed not to spill oil in it (not even moisture lol), but its also designed to build up pressure to 4 bar, not run 24/7 with almost no resistance, so its running hot (and I assume will break sooner or later), but its working in intervals of 15 min on/15 min off.

I got no idea though.. how much air makes sense to pump in a 55 gallon barrel with water flowing at ~6000 liter/hr ? More is always better I suppose?

 

[addy1]

http://www.bassresource.com/fish_biology/aerating_ponds.html

Here is an article about using air to help with anaerobic bacteria, written about bass but will work for other fish lol

 

[DrDave]

Great article on how to clean up the HS gas without depleating the oxygen.

 

[vertigo72]

Interesting article indeed. I dont think my pond is that bad though (I hope), I cant smell any sulfur or perhaps I dont know what sulfur smells like..

Some more pics. I hope I will be able to post a "before and after" in a month or two.

This is the pond:


Yes, I know my lawn is terrible. One thing at a time

On the left you see the marsh with among other plants, irisses.




This is where I hid the barrels:



4th and 5th will have to wait a bit.

Vortex:


Difficult to say on the pic, but the residue on the pipes ought to say something. Thats the result of 6 hours of pumping without stirring. I will also add some brushes next week.

Here Im experimenting with some plants in barrel #2:


Underneath the plants are mainly cut PVC pipes and some ripped spiraling gardenhose. Also has the airstone.

Barrel n3 only has some left over material in it (plastic media will arrive next week), lavarocks and some other rocks (forgot the name) in bags. Not nearly enough, but better than nothing. Also trying to see if floating plants would survive in there:



This is the right side of the pond:


There is a pump in there that pumps to a pressure filter and from the pressure filter it goes to the marsh.

Look really good, there is fish in there, somewhere!

 

[sissy]

you will know sulfer when you smell it

 

[addy1]

like the set up, nice iris area too, that will help keep your pond clean.

 

[sissy]

Your pond may be getting to much run off looking at a couple of the pics up close your land looks higher around the sides than the pond .That will cause your water to get dirty faster and fertilizer getting into your pond from your yard.I like how you hid your filters because I cannot see where they are at .I also like how you put your plants in your filter in plant baskets in pea gravel .Gosh looking close still cannot find your filters.I only see a hose so far