Moving bed, sand and gravel or skippy?

[Nepen]

Laguna does have a smaller size, which I did see on ebay or amazon. As far as clean out, I thought that the plants used all the waste and you just had to thin out the plants. One comment mentioned air blowout just like a sand and gravel filter, but cant see that happening w plants in there. I will ask in the comments on youtube. There is another guy on Youtube that made a few videos on gravel bogs. CrazyFishFarmer He doesn't mention blow out either. Look him up too. I got a lot of ideas from him too. He's the one that showed that you can keep the water level higher. He used different layers of rocks in his.

Thank you for telling me this I thought this is the case but then I read somewhere about the solid waste build up too much and need to flush once in a while. I remember Addy (she has a beautiful big bog) said something about it that she tried to clean her bog once and didnt find much in there. But since her bog is huge and my container is super tiny in comparison I'm not sure what I can expect from mine. So hearing this from you makes me feel better
My container is not as tall as the tub in the YouTube but I will be able to have at least 4 layers in there. My plan is from bottom - bigger rocks (golf to half golf ball size) then pea gravels (more like black bean size!) then sand then activated carbon then the same pea gravels. IF this worked then I will be making more container!

What type of plants do you have in there?

 

[crsublette]

Laguna does have a smaller size, which I did see on ebay or amazon. As far as clean out, I thought that the plants used all the waste and you just had to thin out the plants. One comment mentioned air blowout just like a sand and gravel filter, but cant see that happening w plants in there. I will ask in the comments on youtube. There is another guy on Youtube that made a few videos on gravel bogs. CrazyFishFarmer He doesn't mention blow out either. Look him up too. I got a lot of ideas from him too. He's the one that showed that you can keep the water level higher. He used different layers of rocks in his.

With a handle such as CrazyFishFarmer, then it sounds like he's an aquaponic hobbyiest. There are folk in this hobby that build their grow beds to be exactly like a bog, with gravel and everything, and rarely ever clean them out. However, rather than water constantly flowing through the bed like a bog, they use a flood and drain management of water.

I suspect most bog owners, if not all, do not blow out their bogs. It is simply not practical when there are plants in there. I would suspect the severe boil of air bubbles would tear up too many roots.

I think, at least what makes sense to me, if bog owners were to do a purge, then it would just involve purging as much as they could around the distribution manifold so to make sure none of the slits or holes in the manifold are clogged. If the water is properly pre-filter from the getgo before water enters the manifold, then I doubt there will ever be a problem from the inside of the manifold.

 

[crsublette]

Thank you for telling me this I thought this is the case but then I read somewhere about the solid waste build up too much and need to flush once in a while. I remember Addy (she has a beautiful big bog) said something about it that she tried to clean her bog once and didnt find much in there. But since her bog is huge and my container is super tiny in comparison I'm not sure what I can expect from mine. So hearing this from you makes me feel better
My container is not as tall as the tub in the YouTube but I will be able to have at least 4 layers in there. My plan is from bottom - bigger rocks (golf to half golf ball size) then pea gravels (more like black bean size!) then sand then activated carbon then the same pea gravels. IF this worked then I will be making more container!

What type of plants do you have in there?

Yep, that is the crux of it and how well you prefilter the water before it enters the bog.

 

[shakaho]

Thank you for telling me this I thought this is the case but then I read somewhere about the solid waste build up too much and need to flush once in a while. I remember Addy (she has a beautiful big bog) said something about it that she tried to clean her bog once and didnt find much in there. But since her bog is huge and my container is super tiny in comparison I'm not sure what I can expect from mine. So hearing this from you makes me feel better
My container is not as tall as the tub in the YouTube but I will be able to have at least 4 layers in there. My plan is from bottom - bigger rocks (golf to half golf ball size) then pea gravels (more like black bean size!) then sand then activated carbon then the same pea gravels. IF this worked then I will be making more container!

What type of plants do you have in there?

It's easy to put a drain valve in a container filter so you can easily drain out muck. Many people find no need to flush a properly built bog filter. I think you will get the best performance from using all pea gravel. Sand will clog and will also sink into the rocks below it making those layers clog as well. Activated carbon needs to be changed periodically, as I understand, so you certainly don't want to bury it under gravel. Read this most useful article on building bog filters.

No, you don't blow out a bog filter, just a sand and gravel filter. That's why you can't put plants in the top of a sand and gravel. Blowing out would damage the plant roots (actually probably blow them to little pieces and discharge them) and distrupt the very complex ecosystem of the bog filter.

 

[Nepen]

It's easy to put a drain valve in a container filter so you can easily drain out muck. Many people find no need to flush a properly built bog filter. I think you will get the best performance from using all pea gravel. Sand will clog and will also sink into the rocks below it making those layers clog as well. Activated carbon needs to be changed periodically, as I understand, so you certainly don't want to bury it under gravel. Read this most useful article on building bog filters.

No, you don't blow out a bog filter, just a sand and gravel filter. That's why you can't put plants in the top of a sand and gravel. Blowing out would damage the plant roots (actually probably blow them to little pieces and discharge them) and distrupt the very complex ecosystem of the bog filter.

Thank you!

Good thing I didnt put anything together yet or I'd have a mess

 

[Tiger1]

tiger... you need not run an aerator pump to get a good boil in a moving bed filter. a venturi will more than suffice.... example in this video.

Thanks for that link Charles!

I was trying to determine where to get them. Thinking along the same lines as you, to eliminate the air pump for the purpose of the MB and use it elsewhere.

Catfishnut

Nevermind... Answered my own question...

At first, I thought Paul's MB filter's venturi was completely gravity flow driven, which it is not.

The 3rd tank with the sub, where it T's off to the bio-filter, is what is supplying water to the MB bio-filter's venturi. Although, there is also water entering from the Radial flow. So, he has a wierd loop going on here to make the venturi work.


Actually, it is quite impressive. Going to see if I can do that to my system so I can save my air pump as a backup air pump or something.


For anyone curious, Turbo Venturi (this one from Aquatic Eco-Systems online) is what he uses.

Keep in mind a venturi is simply not just a plane pipe-T with an air tube on top. There is actually a restrictor, inside venturi, that forces more air to be pulled in from the air tube.

1) Yes, that is my plan. I've tested the flow over the barrel with a tee. Bushing on top of tee with snug tube going down to get the the Venturi. It makes a nice boil. Not to strong and not too low.

Very interesting.

Picture of the venturi ??


2) Plan on a sealed 5 gal bucket with pvc running all the way down through the lid(uniseal) so water can come up through media and back out another hole in lid. Would this reduce my water pressure? It would be an inclosed water tight system.

Any resistance will add to your system's total head height... It will depend on the media...

That sounds great! Actually after looking at the video, the container is way too big for me right now, I have a small space But I can use the tips about the elbow to control the water level in the container I have (or it might not be neccessary at all for my small container) and other stuff, will be good for future reference though. I bought the river gravel from Home Depot, it's not as small as pea gravel but I think that'll do. I'll add a sand layer and a activated carbon layer (this is a may be) too, thinking about having a larger rocks at the bottom.. But I'm not sure how to clean the container or if that is neccessary if I have plants in there.


Thanks CountryEscape, I wish I could do it differently now with the bog and pond like that but I have a small space and a raised pond so I have to have seperate bog so the container bog is my only way to go for this pond

Here is a video I had to quickly put together to show my Venturi and bog workings. Was running out of daylight and battery life. Died at the end but I think I fit it all in.

 

[Tiger1]

 

[crsublette]

Thank you!

Good thing I didnt put anything together yet or I'd have a mess

In regards to the sand, it depends on the granule size. Never use playground sand unless wanting to make a cheap denitrator.

Top layer of the conventional S&G is often a sand product but is in the sieve size of #1 through #12; this number is usually referenced on the product. I think playground sand is around #20, which is too fine. From the inventor or first big proponent of the S&G in the koi hobby, here is a S&G that successfully uses #12 sand.

So, if you wanted to test the idea, then use sand that is #12 or bigger such as #8 sand blasting sand or #1 Fine Chicken Grit.


If the sand did sink into the gravel, then it is not far. If it was, then an open system circulating soil wicking grow bed would not work when it is created on top of various sized rock layers.

 

[crsublette]

Very nice. :afro: :banana: :claphands: