I hope you are correct.waynefrcan said:
George Zimmerman Trial
- Thread starter waynefrcan
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Im not sure what point you are trying to make here?waynefrcan said:
The GUN has a lot to do with this case. Zimmerman stalked and approached this guy because he had a gun on his hip. He thought he was tough enough to approach a teen and question him aggressively enough to frighten Trayvon and make him lash out. Yes he called the police and promptly ignored their instructions and took it upon himself to do something he had no training and not enough common sense for. If he had just followed Trayvon from a distance, the teen would be alive and Zimmerman would not be the pariah he is now. Zimmerman should be charged with making a chain of stupid mistakes that ended in death.
I've wondered with regards to the CC laws and "Stand your ground" statute, if Trayvon had been older and legally carrying and Zimmerman approached him and Trayvon put a hole in his chest first, would there have been any charges? I fear that with more idiots armed we're going to be seeing a lot of that. On the flip side, when everyone has a gun, I think people will be more polite. Although I have no need for a gun, I'm not anti CC. I believe that people have a right to peace of mind, but we as civilisation / nation have just not evolved enough to make it a good idea for everybody.
I've wondered with regards to the CC laws and "Stand your ground" statute, if Trayvon had been older and legally carrying and Zimmerman approached him and Trayvon put a hole in his chest first, would there have been any charges? I fear that with more idiots armed we're going to be seeing a lot of that. On the flip side, when everyone has a gun, I think people will be more polite. Although I have no need for a gun, I'm not anti CC. I believe that people have a right to peace of mind, but we as civilisation / nation have just not evolved enough to make it a good idea for everybody.
Welcome to the site. I see this is your first post. This is still the USA and people who dont want to carry a gun dont have to but it is a right. Unfortunately you are right that some people have not evelved enough to make it a good idea for them to carry, which is why the people who have evolved MUST!morrie said:
waynefrcan
19 years ponding and hopefully 4 more!
Interesting morrie, I don't agree but then it doesn't matter. Follow the guy or not, the punk attacked him and severly beat him. His screams for help did no good, so out came the gun. This Zimmerman is short, fat, weak and timid and the punk saw this, for an easy beat down.
IF he would have went home instead of going MMA on Zimmerman he would be alive as well.
I would have done almost the exact same thing if i was a Watch Captain for the area which has had many breakins and 1 home invasion by all black perps. My difference is that I might have told him when he circled the car that I was neighborhood watch. But then when the punk made like he had a gun like alittle gangsta that might have stopped me as well.
IF he would have went home instead of going MMA on Zimmerman he would be alive as well.
I would have done almost the exact same thing if i was a Watch Captain for the area which has had many breakins and 1 home invasion by all black perps. My difference is that I might have told him when he circled the car that I was neighborhood watch. But then when the punk made like he had a gun like alittle gangsta that might have stopped me as well.
waynefrcan
19 years ponding and hopefully 4 more!
Then change the law. Sure carry a gun but if you use it and kill someone we will put you in jail for 30 years. Stupid IMO.
morrie said:
That's true Wayne which is why I think manslaughter and murder charges are a reach in this case and clearly driven by politcal correctness. But Zimmerman and the neighborhood watch committe are sure to lose in the follow up civil trial. What if it was you and you were approached by a stranger and asked where were you going, maybe grabbed you. What would you do? As Diesel says, "this is still the USA" and Trayvon had a right to be where he was and Zimmerman had no right to question him. Is he a punk because he was black teen or because he didn't need a gun to take down Zimmerman. Trayvon wasn't doing anything illegal. Just a kid walking home.
Had it been a policeman questioning him, I doubt Trayvon would have reacted the way he did. If he had, a trained officer would probably have not have let it escalate to the point of a shooting. We know from tapes of Zimmermans previous calls that he was aggressive in his neighborhood watch activities and only called police to report black and hispanic males and that's profiling which even law enforcement is banned from doing. And judging from the recorded screams, it was Zimmerman who was the punk of the two. And we all know how dangerous punks with guns are.
The whole thing is a tradgedy with errors made on both sides. Zimmerman stupidly approached him and Trayvon stupidly over reacted to a scared little man. They both should have gone their own ways. Trayvon would be alive and Zimmermans life would not be ruined. On the streets I grew up on, if you stepped up to someone and got beat up for it, it was your fault for showing poor judgement. Which is about all they shoud try Zimmerman for.
Had it been a policeman questioning him, I doubt Trayvon would have reacted the way he did. If he had, a trained officer would probably have not have let it escalate to the point of a shooting. We know from tapes of Zimmermans previous calls that he was aggressive in his neighborhood watch activities and only called police to report black and hispanic males and that's profiling which even law enforcement is banned from doing. And judging from the recorded screams, it was Zimmerman who was the punk of the two. And we all know how dangerous punks with guns are.
The whole thing is a tradgedy with errors made on both sides. Zimmerman stupidly approached him and Trayvon stupidly over reacted to a scared little man. They both should have gone their own ways. Trayvon would be alive and Zimmermans life would not be ruined. On the streets I grew up on, if you stepped up to someone and got beat up for it, it was your fault for showing poor judgement. Which is about all they shoud try Zimmerman for.
crsublette
coyotes call me Charles
The gun has nothing to do with it. It took 2 months, a fired policed chief, and prosecutor shopping by race baiters and the judicial branch to look for a prosecutor willing to bring charges with the lack of evidence, beyond a reasonable doubt, on Zimmerman. It is pure politics and race baiting brought this case to court and quite likely gun haters that ironically support the idea of " Trayvon should have also had a gun so to shoot Zimmerman for simply following him ".
The gun was not even introduced until Zimmerman was getting his skull bashed into the concrete.
This is a perfect example ignoring witness testimonial that explicitly states the fight was occuring not far from Zimmerman's vehicle. How could this happen?? Either... Zimmerman was walking to his vehicle or he was dragging Trayvon near his pickup and then the fight began. Or... As Zimmerman was heading back to his vehicle, Trayvon jumped out of the bushes to give Zimmerman a beating, which Trayvon has a history of doing except the judge did not allow this evidence and told the jury to disregard. There was zero evidence indicating Zimmerman dragged Trayvon near his vehicle.
This is the exact reason why neighborhood watch folk in very rough neighborhoods should be concealed gun carriers. Ya never know when you will be attacked for simply following a kid to make sure the kid was not up to no good.
Nobody has the right to roam free at night not to be questioned, lurking around on other folk's front yards, which is as described by witnesses. This idea of folk find it right to assuault a person for simply being followed and questioned; this is the actions of a criminal as defined by aggravated assault.
The first illegal act here was Trayvon's obvious over reaction to go MMA on Zimmerman. Just guess what a concealed gun carry would do... This is exactly why folk should be concealed gun carriers.
The gun was not even introduced until Zimmerman was getting his skull bashed into the concrete.
This is a perfect example ignoring witness testimonial that explicitly states the fight was occuring not far from Zimmerman's vehicle. How could this happen?? Either... Zimmerman was walking to his vehicle or he was dragging Trayvon near his pickup and then the fight began. Or... As Zimmerman was heading back to his vehicle, Trayvon jumped out of the bushes to give Zimmerman a beating, which Trayvon has a history of doing except the judge did not allow this evidence and told the jury to disregard. There was zero evidence indicating Zimmerman dragged Trayvon near his vehicle.
This is the exact reason why neighborhood watch folk in very rough neighborhoods should be concealed gun carriers. Ya never know when you will be attacked for simply following a kid to make sure the kid was not up to no good.
Nobody has the right to roam free at night not to be questioned, lurking around on other folk's front yards, which is as described by witnesses. This idea of folk find it right to assuault a person for simply being followed and questioned; this is the actions of a criminal as defined by aggravated assault.
The first illegal act here was Trayvon's obvious over reaction to go MMA on Zimmerman. Just guess what a concealed gun carry would do... This is exactly why folk should be concealed gun carriers.
Zimmerman himself stated that he got out of the car and went to see where Trayvon had gone. Trayvon had hid in the bushes.
Now he sees this stranger out and about looking for him.
What the hell does Trayvon know what Zimmerman wants, human trafficking, robbery, serial killer??????????
So, now he sees him out and about physically looking for him. In my experience of life, if you're not out looking for trouble but trouble is out looking for you, and you hide and tried to avoid it but it's still coming, it's best to get the jump on it.
Neighborhood watches are not suppose to carry guns and not suppose to confront anyone, only call the police. Zimmerman is a grown man and he knows this. There is no reason for a 17 year old, black/white, green, yellow, orange person to be dead.
I don't believe he intentionally went to actually use his gun, but he does have to pay for his poor decision. Isn't there some kind of vigilantly law out there they can charge him with. That's probably closer to what happened. Manslaughter, is what happened. Zimmerman brought a gun to a fist fight, that is why he was so bold.
As a mother of a once teenage male, now full grown. I know, even if it happened to him now (27) if someone was pursuing my son, he would try to turn it around on them.
Now he sees this stranger out and about looking for him.
What the hell does Trayvon know what Zimmerman wants, human trafficking, robbery, serial killer??????????
So, now he sees him out and about physically looking for him. In my experience of life, if you're not out looking for trouble but trouble is out looking for you, and you hide and tried to avoid it but it's still coming, it's best to get the jump on it.
Neighborhood watches are not suppose to carry guns and not suppose to confront anyone, only call the police. Zimmerman is a grown man and he knows this. There is no reason for a 17 year old, black/white, green, yellow, orange person to be dead.
I don't believe he intentionally went to actually use his gun, but he does have to pay for his poor decision. Isn't there some kind of vigilantly law out there they can charge him with. That's probably closer to what happened. Manslaughter, is what happened. Zimmerman brought a gun to a fist fight, that is why he was so bold.
As a mother of a once teenage male, now full grown. I know, even if it happened to him now (27) if someone was pursuing my son, he would try to turn it around on them.
Im sorry to tell you that although neighborhood watch participants "aren't supposed to carry a gun" they are surely allowed to. Zimmerman called the police. He went to look for Martin so the police could locate him when they arrived. Martin attacked him. Zimmerman protected himself. Can't prove any more than that. The kid was on drugs at the time and has been proven to be a thug. I don't see why anyone would defend him.
It was a dispatcher and its sad day in America when people do whatever the police tell them. It mag have taken them a very long time to get there, if they ever showed up at all.
crsublette
coyotes call me Charles
Koigal50 said:
Yep, and that is irrelevant to the case unless, as folk apparently like to do, suggesting that disobeying police means you are guilty of obsolutely every single action that follows.
When anybody chooses to perform aggravated assault on a conceal gun carrier, then yes there will be consequences. This is not vigilante justice.
I can tell you my first reaction would not be to turn around to go fist flying crazy on a guy following or watching me. I have lived in some rough neighborhoods as well and this absolutely would not even remotely be my first reasonable thought to do. You don't know what they got. My first thought would be to run, not walk nor skipp, get my butt home, and not turn around. Seriously, if you have ever honestly lived in a bad neighborhood, then would your first thought be to to jump the guy as he is watching, following you, or walking away or do ya pull some evasive moves to get your run home.
Leaving out any possible suspicious activities by Trayvon, let's assume for one moment that Trayvon is frightend and hiding FROM Zimmerman (forget he may know the police are coming) ... Have you seen ZIMMERMAN AND TRAYVON??? I weigh less than 130 lbs and could out run a short legged rolly polly man hands down ... Now let's look at Trayvon ... He looks like a 6' tall, 160 beanpole to me with LONG legs ... Not once has anyone accused Trayvon of being mentally or physically ill ...Koigal50 said:
Now look at basic survival ... Fight or flee ... UNLESS CORNERED, an INNOCENT VICTIM (Trayvon) would FLEE if the option was available ...
Have you ever heard of citizen's arrest? It is legal in many states, INCLUDING Florida.Koigal50 said:
Now if bringing a gun to a fist fight was his intent, why didnt he pull it sooner, instead of getting the crap beat out of him before drawing???? Maybe Zimmerman isnt the brightest, but it was not manslaughter. He will pay for his errors in judgement, and then some. I think he should get off, as there was never a chance of a fair trail, but believe the jury will go with the lessor charge.Koigal50 said:
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