drawing up plans for water garden with fish

[Maggie71]

I am sure the guys at Koi Pen have a great BD setup for Koi but it sounds a bit like a whirlpool. Maggie wants goldfish, and plants, most everyone wants water lilies. The lilies and many types of goldfish do not like current.

It seems to me this engine is on the wrong track.

Yes, I was leaning towards comets or shubunkins, lilies, and a good variety of plants. Maybe I'd be better off with less equipment. A waterfall and submerged plants would be enough to oxygenate, probably need a filter for mechanical filtration and a good net? I don't think I'd mind getting in the pond to clean (depends on how cold and how deep)

 

[Maggie71]

Maggie, one of the first things you need to decide is what kind of pond do you want? Koi pond, goldfish pond, water garden, wildlife habitat? Then, think about things like what does clear water mean to you? How do you feel about having a lot of frogs and tadpoles? Do you want plants in and around your pond? How important is it to you to protect your fish from invaders? How much water noise do you want to hear? How much daily, weekly, quarterly cleaning to you want to do? Do you mind getting wet? And occasionally getting into the pond.

Frogs and tadpoles? I want a good variety of plants and a few comet or shubunkin goldfish, I've read they can spawn heavily, not sure what to do about that. Also read turtles can destroy plants, are frogs relatively harmless? The goldfish will nibble at the plant but they shouldn't destroy them right?

 

[HTH]

Maggie if you are going to crawl into the pond I suggest getting waders.

Only bare root plants consume nutrients and we generally do not depend on plants for oxygenation. The waterfall will take care of that.

The challenge with potted plants is keeping the dirt out of the water. Kitty litter is used for potting by many here. I used to put small rocks on top the dirt but the plants got knocked over and I would have dirt and rocks in water. Bad idea but it was popular at the time and is still about the only way to slow koi down. They love to dig in the pots for some sort of insect. I have not seen goldfish do that.

A pond the size you are proposing would take care of itself without a filter but you do need to circulate the water. Water movement is important to expel bad gases.. To get clear water you are going to need filtration. Even then you may have periods where the water is not clear. Once the pond has cycled UV is an option.

 

[Mucky_Waters]

I am sure the guys at Koi Pen have a great BD setup for Koi but it sounds a bit like a whirlpool. Maggie wants goldfish, and plants, most everyone wants water lilies. The lilies and many types of goldfish do not like current.

It seems to me this engine is on the wrong track.

Not sure what you are talking about? I have comet goldfish, fantails, blackmoor, minnows, frogs, tadpoles that turned into frog, turtles and lots of plants, none of them are effected by the current or my bottom drain. If you are insinuating that you can't have those things and have a bottom drain in your pond then you are on the wrong track.
Maggie asked the opinion of anybody who used bottom drains, most people in this forum don't have them, that is why I suggested she check in over at the koiphen forum, since many of the people over there have them and recommend them, an yes many of the people over there have lovely water gardens with plants and goldfish too.
I know from previous posts that waterbug cleaned ponds professionally (or at least earned and income at it), he also has a web page about cleaning methods and tools, like pond vacuums that he designed and sold, if that doesn't make him and "expert" I don't know what does???
The wink was to indicate that if Maggies gets talked out of a bottom drain she'll definitely be needing all those tools and techniques, and maybe some of those services. I've went that route before in my old pond, never again, no thanks, there's an easier way. By the time you invest in pond vacuum, pool net, hip waders you could have easily plumbed in a bottom drain and let it do the work for you.

HTH, Here's a picture of my pond with a bottom drain, do the plants appear to be struggling because of the current?