Water Changes

[crsublette]

For GH to be a percentage of salinity, this involves an extra conversion to express GH as a percentage of salinity. As shown in my previous PDF about Chloride and Salinity... For Chloride to be a percentage of salinity, this involves an extra conversion to express Chloride as a percentage of salinity.

GH test results, on its own merits without an additional conversion, is actually not a percentage of salinity even though salinity is a "catch all" that also includes multivalent cations (calcium and magnesium).

 

[Meyer Jordan]

I certainly agree that use of the term 'Total Salinity' would seem more appropriate than 'Salinity' in describing the total ionic concentration in either water or soil, but the scientific community obviously feels otherwise.

 

[crsublette]

People are calling particular tests "salinity tests" when they actually are not "salinity" tests.

Only 2 true "salinity" tests are done by a TDS (total dissolved salts) meter and a EC (electrical conductivity) meter.

Salinity Hydrometer and Salinity Refractometers are actually measuring the DENSITY of the water... not the salts in the water... However, salt concentrations do change the density of water, but different salts changes the density moreso than other salts.

Sodium Chloride test kits are testing the water for a mass weight measurement of just the Sodium Chloride salt compound, which is not the same a test for Sodium nor Chloride nor salinity.

A chloride test kit is testing the water for a mass weight measurement of just the Chloride anion.

A chlorine test kit is testing for the chlorine gas byproducts in water.

Outside of a Sodium ion spectrometer, there is no direct test for the mass weight of Sodium involving a single test. To get Sodium, this actually involves 3 seperate titration tests, which then the result of these tests are put into a formula to determine mass weight of Sodium.

 

[crsublette]

if you evaporate water from a container of water only the pure water and other volatilizes will evaporate leaving the concentrated minerals behind.

@Mucky_Waters If you really want to know if your water is building up too much salt due to water evaporation, then I would watch the results from a Density/specific gravity test (best done through a refractometer or hydrometer) and a Electronic Conductivity test.

As for wanting to know specific salts, then specific tests would need to be involved.

 

[crsublette]

@Mucky_Waters Here is a good article for ya to consider...

TDS devices are basically just a Conductivity meter except with extra mathematical computations in the TDS device. You have more flexibility, by choosing your own TDS constant (dependent on what you are testing), by just using a Conductivity meter.

Conductivity, Salinity, and Total Dissolved Solids
http://www.fondriest.com/environmen...ters/water-quality/conductivity-salinity-tds/

Measuring the Salinity of Water
http://agriculture.vic.gov.au/agric...ater/salinity/measuring-the-salinity-of-water

 

[Mucky_Waters]

"Salinity" is just a single test result of ALL dissolved salts in the water, not any particular one salt.

Both you and Meyers have said this, but then you provide links that state otherwise.
Here is the link you posted earlier. http://www2.vernier.com/sample_labs/WQV-15-COMP-chloride_salinity.pdf
And here is a quote from there first line second paragraph. "Salinity is the total of all non-carbonate salts dissolved in water, usually expressed in parts per thousand (1 ppt = 1000 mg/L)."

 

[sissy]

have to ask this since my dad taught me this being we owned a small farm ,to add epsom salts to the soil to boost fertilizers .He used to add it to his compost tea .If people do this to the lawn and the lawn flood what would happen if it did run into the pond .I don't get ruin off into my pond but I do know that some landscapers add it when they seed new lawns around here .I use it all the time for all my fruiting trees and my lawn .Just a question I wondered about

 

[Meyer Jordan]

Both you and Meyers have said this, but then you provide links that state otherwise.
Here is the link you posted earlier. http://www2.vernier.com/sample_labs/WQV-15-COMP-chloride_salinity.pdf
And here is a quote from there first line second paragraph. "Salinity is the total of all non-carbonate salts dissolved in water, usually expressed in parts per thousand (1 ppt = 1000 mg/L)."

Randy, This is a sample page from a Wter Quality Lab manual offered by Vernier. Even this individual company can not seem to agree of definitions. This link is to the same company concerning the exact same lab course "Water Quality". Read the first line regarding 'Salinity'.
http://www.vernier.com/experiments/wqv/15/chloride_and_salinity/

 

[Mucky_Waters]

Randy, This is a sample page from a Wter Quality Lab manual offered by Vernier. Even this individual company can not seem to agree of definitions. This link is to the same company concerning the exact same lab course "Water Quality". Read the first line regarding 'Salinity'.
http://www.vernier.com/experiments/wqv/15/chloride_and_salinity/

Interesting.
Thank you

 

[crsublette]

Both you and Meyers have said this, but then you provide links that state otherwise.
Here is the link you posted earlier. http://www2.vernier.com/sample_labs/WQV-15-COMP-chloride_salinity.pdf
And here is a quote from there first line second paragraph. "Salinity is the total of all non-carbonate salts dissolved in water, usually expressed in parts per thousand (1 ppt = 1000 mg/L)."

@Mucky_Waters

I agree with @Meyer Jordan ... I did some research into this and only that particular company uses the qualifier of "non-carbonate salts" in conjunction with salinity.

The best I can figure is they are talking about what is called "non-electrolytes" salts, that is salts that do not have a conductivity. (https://www.smc.edu/AcademicProgram...riments/Electrical_Conductivity_procedure.pdf)

Carbonate (or non-electrolyte) salts would be precipitated salts such as Calcium Carbonate, Magnesium Carbonate, Iron Carbonate... However, weak electrolyte carbonate salts (such as Potassium Carbonate and Sodium Carbonate) do add to the conductivity to help determine the salinity.

I think the Conductivity, Salinity & Total Dissolved Solids reference, in a previous post here, really provides the best clarification.

"Salinity is an ambiguous term. As a basic definition, salinity is the total concentration of all dissolved salts in water. These electrolytes form ionic particles as they dissolve, each with a positive and negative charge. As such, salinity is a strong contributor to conductivity. Conductivity is a measure of water’s capability to pass electrical flow. This ability is directly related to the concentration of ions in the water. These conductive ions come from dissolved salts and inorganic materials such as alkalis, chlorides, sulfides and carbonate compounds. Compounds that dissolve into ions are also known as electrolytes."

 

[Meyer Jordan]

Non-carbonate (or non-electrolyte) salts would be precipitated salts such as Calcium Carbonate, Magnesium Carbonate, Iron Carbonate... However, weak electrolyte carbonate salts (such as Potassium Carbonate and Sodium Carbonate) do add to the conductivity to help determine the salinity.

I think that you meant to say Carbonate salts here as those mentioned are all Carbonate salts.

 

[crsublette]

have to ask this since my dad taught me this being we owned a small farm ,to add epsom salts to the soil to boost fertilizers .He used to add it to his compost tea .If people do this to the lawn and the lawn flood what would happen if it did run into the pond .I don't get ruin off into my pond but I do know that some landscapers add it when they seed new lawns around here .I use it all the time for all my fruiting trees and my lawn .Just a question I wondered about

@sissy Ironically, in the nishikigoi hobby, they actually dose their pond water with epsom salt (magnesium sulfate) as well as calcium chloride to boost their water hardness since they found this helps their fish and to boost magnesium (if it is too low) to help with biofilm growth... according to them

 

[crsublette]

I think that you meant to say Carbonate salts here as those mentioned are all Carbonate salts.

Thank ya... and now corrected.

 

[sissy]

@sissy Ironically, in the nishikigoi hobby, they actually dose their pond water with epsom salt (magnesium sulfate) as well as calcium chloride to boost their water hardness since they found this helps their fish and to boost magnesium (if it is too low) to help with biofilm growth... according to them

I wonder if that is for koi only .I will have to ask Eric to ask his koi friend about it.interesting idea

 

[Meyer Jordan]

@sissy Ironically, in the nishikigoi hobby, they actually dose their pond water with epsom salt (magnesium sulfate) as well as calcium chloride to boost their water hardness since they found this helps their fish and to boost magnesium (if it is too low) to help with biofilm growth... according to them

Yes, I have seen many references to this practice, but totally unnecessary in a pond if boosting Magnesium is the targeted goal as this element is already an added ingredient in most fish food.