ulcers again!

[Rach B]

Hi fish people, u may remember my first post about my ulcer problems last year, i bought loads of new little fish and i lost them nearly all with nasty ulcers. My water was fine and i treated the pond 2 or 3 times for ulcers with no success.

sooooo, i have a shubumkin with an ulcer, now im sure he had it last year but now the weather is warming up and hes active ive noticed it more. So my question is, shall i remove him? Can he pass the ulcer bug to other fish i dont want to lose any more?

any help wud be greatly appreciated, thanks

 

[Meyer Jordan]

Hi fish people, u may remember my first post about my ulcer problems last year, i bought loads of new little fish and i lost them nearly all with nasty ulcers. My water was fine and i treated the pond 2 or 3 times for ulcers with no success.

sooooo, i have a shubumkin with an ulcer, now im sure he had it last year but now the weather is warming up and hes active ive noticed it more. So my question is, shall i remove him? Can he pass the ulcer bug to other fish i dont want to lose any more?

any help wud be greatly appreciated, thanks

Rach, it would seem that you have a water quality problem that is resulting in the immune system being compromised in your fish. This opens them up to myriad disease and pathogenic problems. As you have already seen, treating the physical manifestations (ulcers) has a best been only a temporary cure. Compromised immunity can always be traced back to stress levels in all animals, including fish. No effort should be spared in determining the source of this stress.
Could you post once more:
-size of your pond, both linear and capacity.
-size of pump and filtration.
-types, sizes and number of fish.
-feeding practices.
-water source, well or municipal.
-predation level.

 

[Rach B]

Hi Jordan,

ok here goes,

size of your pond, both linear and capacity. Is 13 x 6 x 2' i think this about 850 gall
-size of pump and filtration. Pump is a pisces intrepid 8000 but it runs filter, mermaid and spit frog. Filter is fishmate 4000 i think, with seperate hozelock uv.
-types, sizes and number of fish, 2x12" grass carp, 1 x 12"koi, 1 x 8" koi then about 10 or so 2 to 3" koi/shubumkins
-feeding practices. Once a day just a handful
-water source, well or municipal. Its a mature pond about 10 years no blanket weed, lots of plants
-predation level. No herons thank God

Think thats about it, water tested at shop 3 times last year and they said it was near perfect, i used to have double the number of fish about 5 years ago with no problems with ulcers, did lose a lot with heron then, also couple of years ago i had a couple die with dropsy but nothjng like that now.

baffled.com!

 

[Rach B]

Just a mention too, the filter sponges need changing just once a week and under the sponges are the white rock media stuff. Do u think if i put the plastic tube bits in the first area where the water runs in that that may help? Thanks again x

 

[Meyer Jordan]

Do the ulcers appear to be localized to a certain area on the fishes' bodies? Are they mainly on the top, bottom or sides of the fish?

 

[Rach B]

Usually just behind the head Jordan, this fish is from last years new stock, no others r affected as yet, fingers crossed

 

[Meyer Jordan]

Are you sure that it is an ulcer. Could it be a puncture wound from Heron's beak?

 

[Rach B]

Im pretty sure they r ulcers, the wounds r about 8mm across n ive googled pictures. Wierd i know

 

[Meyer Jordan]

You are aware, assuming that the fish is otherwise healthy, that ulcers are cuts, abrasions, puncture wounds etc. that have become infected by bacteria that cause the ulceration. Do you have any sharp edged stones or objects in your pond? Either the fish are damaging themselves or are being injured by predators..

 

[Dave 54]

Did you clear your pond of dead leaves erc and clean the filter prior to winter , as it gives them a better chance coming out of winter clear of problems such as this...
You come from the Uk which is fantastic because you can buy what we in the koi world use on ulcers ,its a treatment which only needs two applications only to clear an ulcer .
Its an ozonated vegetable oil based treatment based on treatments in Japanese hospitals for humans .
It is expensive at £25.00+ but you only need a little bit of gel at a time and it will treat up to 50 fish the rest of the time it sits in the fridge until needed again :-

http://www.absolute-koi.com/prod2087.html

I hope this helps , [I'm still on my first tub 5 years in].

Dave

 

[Rach B]

Send me a drop in a pot Dave lol! Yes i net the pond in winter i do jet the filter a bit but cant dismantle it in spring cos of how it is plumbed, wired in.

Jordan there isnt anything really that they cud hurt themselves with.

Will this ulcered fish affect my other healthy ones?

ur help is great thanks again x

 

[Rach B]

PS - Dave I was joking about the pot lol!

 

[Dave 54]

It may well be an areomonas infection they are normally seen this time of the year its known as areomonas ally in that all fish run the guantlet of becoming infected with a bacterial infection namely Areomnas hydrophia which is found in al ponds it normally attacks when your fish become stressed through poor water quality, temperature fluctuations, overcrowding and other factors .
If identified early a good bacteriacide should clear things up .
However it is vital this is caught in its early stages in later stages it can prove near impossible to treat.
Flavobacteruim Columnares is another bacterium that could prove to be a problem for us the fish keeper if this is suspected then its best to take a swab of the fish and get the vet to identyfy the correct antibacterial treatment to use ,


Dave

 

[Rach B]

Jeez Dave, you're getting too technical for me now, I think im just gonna get rid of the bad fish and hope for the best.

 

[Dave 54]

Jeez Dave, you're getting too technical for me now, I think im just gonna get rid of the bad fish and hope for the best.

Technical me no way I always dumb my answers down so that they can be understood
A goldfish looked after propperly will live to 40 years old you owe it to them to treat them people often view them as throwaway comodities which they are not they have a right to live just as you and I do.
Just because my wife has Muscular Dystrophy doesnt mean I should throw her over for a new wife does it , no far from it I care for her as best I can for the rest of our lives , just as we do for our pets.
Did you know our oldest koi Browntop is now in his 28 year of age , she once had an ulcer it almost went through one side of her tail [my fault I was stripping out their then tank and she became infected , so I caused it it was down to me to fix it which I did.
Look at it this way a fishes defence is its slime coat the ulcer has been caused by bacteria getting through that slime coat it is down to us to put this right .
Go to your fish shop tell them you have an ulcer and you need a good off the shelf anti-bacterial treatment or buy the koi clear Gel .
We can only give you answers to your questions its down to you to take the action .
So please no more talk of getting rid of the bad fish , their problem isnt their fault its ours we allowed it to happen.

Dave