Several Sick Fish; Different Symptoms

[xkenneth86]

Hey Everyone,

I’ve got several sick fish I am trying to nurse back to health. We had to move our pond from our old house unexpectedly and I didn’t want to leave them behind.

Here’s the summary of what I see:

I have two Black Moors that are spending a lot of time laying on the bottom of the tank. They seem to be trending the right direction.

I’ve got one larger fantail goldfish that is blowing bubbles and spending too much time near the surface and a lot of time resting upright on pots. Im not sure he’s trending the right direction.

I have two small fantails (both orange) that have developed a bad case of ick. I have constructed a 30 gallon hospital tank and am treating them with an API Ick treatment. They seem to be trending the right direction.

History:
New pond, 300 gallon Rubber Maid stock tank, just over a week old. Brought plants from old tank, new filters.

Pond was in direct sunlight for a few days but then I realized the water temp was getting to the low 90’s. Wife and I moved the pond back into about 80% shade. Pond temps seem to be stating much lower, in the 70s and low 80s.

Keeping an eye on levels with strips and liquid test kit 2-3 times a day.

Treating the main tank with Pimafex and Malefix daily, today was the 3rd day, plan to do it for 7 days.

Open to advice, willing to go far to make sure this little guys are happy and healthy.

Thanks!

 

[xkenneth86]

Here’s the data from today

Temp about 84-86 after the sun went down, will try to get a better reading tomorrow

Test Strip

GH 180PPM

KH 120PPM

pH 7-7.5

Nitrite 0

Nitrate 0



Test Kit

Nitrite 0 PPM

pH 6.5

Phosphate 0PPM

Ammonia 0.25 to 0.5 PPM

 

[xkenneth86]

I’ve added a few pictures of some of the fish that are floating on the surface or hanging out at the bottom.

Looks like one black Moore and one big spotted fantail hanging out on surface.

I’ve got two other fantail goldfish and one black Moore resting at the bottom.

They seem to be active about half the time and chilling on the bottom half the time. They’re not just stuck on the bottom.

Side note: the water is from my water well and it shouldn’t have chlorine but I treat it the same.

 

[WaterGardener]

Since you have a new filter, your new set up has no beneficial bacteria to process the toxic ammonia that is being produced by your fish. Your tank is going through a new nitrogen cycle. The ammonia being produced by the fish has no bacteria to convert it to nitrite then to the less harmful nitrate.

The pH is in the acidic range, and the bacteria will have a difficult time growing in that pH. But the ammonia is less toxic at a low pH, so you are between a rock and a hard place.

Prime will bind the ammonia and nitrite and protect the fish. For that purpose it will last 48 hours and will need to be dosed again. You will have to keep doing that until the nitrogen cycle is complete, likely several weeks.

If you bind the ammonia with Prime, you can safely raise the pH with baking soda. Do that gradually so as not to add more stress to the fish.

Adding additional aeration is always a good idea, if you don't already have that.

Also, when treating for ich, you need to treat the entire tank, not just the fish. There will be unhatched eggs in the tank that will need to be dealt with, so all the pond needs to be treated.

You can continue the Primafix and Melafix if you want, but there is very little evidence that it actually does anything, except cost you money.

Read up on the nitrogen cycle and you will find lots of information on how to get your fish through this.

 

[Mmathis]

Agree with @WaterGardener, especially about the biofilter…..and learning about the nitrogen cucle.

 

[Mgessert]

In addition to what’s been mentioned, I would continue 10-20% daily water changes until the ammonia is gone.

 

[xkenneth86]

Started treatment with Pond Prime just now. Did 3 capfuls for 150 gallons.

I am fasting the fish for 3 days and then planning on feeding peas. On day 2. I also lowered that water level 50% to 150 gallons. This was a recommendation to reduce pressure on fish that were having air bladder problems.

I will test the numbers in an hour or two to see how the levels are after pond prime.

I will performance a 10-20% water change this evening.

I treated one fish for Ich yesterdays, waiting for enough Ich medicine to come in Saturday to treat the whole pond. I know the whole pond needs to be treated but treating the individual fish seems to buy some time for that fish.

A few fishes skin is white and splotchy? Is this Ich? Or something else. I am used to Ich being white spots.

 

[WaterGardener]

The water tests will show all the ammonia and nitrite in the system. They don't differentiate the bound ammonia from the unbound. So don't expect your tests to show anything different. It will show total ammonia.

Can you get pictures of the white spots? Ich is very small specks, so that doesn't sound like ich.

 

[xkenneth86]

The water tests are still showing little to no ammonia or nitrite in the system.

I have lost two big goldfish in the last two days.

I am pretty sure I’m going to lose 1 or 2 more tomorrow.

Im not sure what to do at this point.

I have attached a couple more pictures of another fish with the same symptoms as the one that died.

Any ideas as to whats ailing these fish?

Could it be aggression from other fish?

 

[Criscar]

The water tests are still showing little to no ammonia or nitrite in the system.

I have lost two big goldfish in the last two days.

I am pretty sure I’m going to lose 1 or 2 more tomorrow.

Im not sure what to do at this point.

I wonder if it might help to consider the sum of all the impacts rather than continuing to look for a singular cause of illness or death in your fish.

If I followed along correctly, the fish endured a move, followed by a massive temperature increase to potentially unsafe levels for fish not acclimated to it, then the a large temperature swing back down again when you moved the pond but then the temps still weren’t very stable?, and it sounds like a Ph swing was involved in the move? (you never mentioned average temps or Ph in prior pond), plus an ammonia increase (0.5 ppm is enough to stress already stressed fish) as the new pond is cycling and an ich outbreak? That would definitely be enough to weaken and kill some of your fish, I would think. Curious to hear others’ thoughts.

Might be better at this point to just put all your focus on stabilizing pond parameters over treating the fish. They need a stable environment most of all and as the first priority.

 

[Criscar]

The water tests are still showing little to no ammonia or nitrite in the system.

I have lost two big goldfish in the last two days.

I am pretty sure I’m going to lose 1 or 2 more tomorrow.

Im not sure what to do at this point.

I have attached a couple more pictures of another fish with the same symptoms as the one that died.

Any ideas as to whats ailing these fish?

Could it be aggression from other fish?

I had to use the edit to fix my reply above this so not sure if that reply was visible at first. In any case, wanted to definitely offer my sympathies to you over the loss of your fish, and hope you dont lose too many more.

I also have the same Rubbermaid stock tank pond and with an above ground pond it is definitely more susceptible to temp swings especially when your set up is new and your plants haven’t fully grown in, etc. For mine, about 40% of it is shaded by a patio umbrella (which also helps to keep away predatory birds in my set up), and I have ridiculous amounts of plants along the margins, a lot growing on the bottom of the pond in gravel and also floating plants, in addition to the bog. Since the plants started growing in a couple months after set up no matter what the weather is doing I don’t get wild temperature swings at all, so the combo of it all is definitely acting as a temperature buffer. GL with getting your new set up figured out!