pH too high

[JustMe]

I would have to agree with the just wait and watch plan. Messing with the pH is tricky business and unless you want to constantly mess with it I wouldn't worry so much if your fish seem OK with it. I was a big aquarium enthusiast before I dug my first pond and even in a 100g tank, trying to keep my pH down while working against my very hard tap water was really a pain. If I needed a lower pH for spawning I bought R/O water,....obviously not feasible for a pond.

 

[jethro13]

right on JustMe status quo

 

[Squidhead]

I've changed my mind about the pH shpeal!
Anyway you say you've pegged out at 9.0 ppm? Does that mean that's all your test kit is capable of? My high range pH test only goes to 8.8ppm which is an almost purple color. When I test something like ammonia, it is an intense purple. Ammonia is like a pH of 10 something ppm. Portland cement leaches calcium hydroxide and can be super basic, up near 13ppm. It can take months for it to cure and get down to a safer level in the high 8's. How long has the mortar been in the water?

 

[jason081180]

I've changed my mind about the pH shpeal!
Anyway you say you've pegged out at 9.0 ppm? Does that mean that's all your test kit is capable of? My high range pH test only goes to 8.8ppm which is an almost purple color. When I test something like ammonia, it is an intense purple. Ammonia is like a pH of 10 something ppm. Portland cement leaches calcium hydroxide and can be super basic, up near 13ppm. It can take months for it to cure and get down to a safer level in the high 8's. How long has the mortar been in the water?

maybe its just me but i find if very confusing when you say 9.0 ppm. PH is not measured in ppm its just a number. like 7 or 8 there is no ppm. maybe I'm wrong but everything I've heard and learned in school never said ppm.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PH

 

[koikeepr]

there you go, Jethro! if your water is naturally set with a Ph of 9.0 and your fish are fine, let it go.

It is very hard to tinker with Ph to lower or raise it if it is not naturally set at that. It will be a nightmare battle to wage to adjust it downward consistently. As long as it's steady and the fish are okay, then let it go. Just make sure to keep up your weekly water changes, and don't slip on that because your high Ph will quickly cause any traces of ammonia to being toxic and kill the fish. You need to ensure you don't have Ph spikes and let it rise higher or drop lower in any given day. Steady is good in Ph, fluctuations are bad.

Heavy plantings in the pond will also cause spikes, because during the day they release oxygen and at night they are releasing C02. So, you want to either limit any plantings or not have any to prevent such spikes.

You will be fine. Just monitor your pond frequently for changes. Best time to check Ph levels and test the pond will be in the evenings for you.

 

[Squidhead]

QUOTE=jason081180;41879]maybe its just me but i find if very confusing when you say 9.0 ppm. PH is not measured in ppm its just a number. like 7 or 8 there is no ppm. maybe I'm wrong but everything I've heard and learned in school never said ppm.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PH[/QUOTE]

Hey Jason, can't tell you why I put ppm after pH. You are right, I don't even know why I started doing that. Maybe from doing CO2 tests on planted tanks? I had kept records using pH and KH to figure out the saturation of CO2. I made my own chart and using ppm for both CO2 and KH and the pH result was in the ppm column. Guess I fooled myself into it? OR, just plain ole' screwed up:redface:

 

[Squidhead]

there you go, Jethro! if your water is naturally set with a Ph of 9.0 and your fish are fine, let it go.

The only concern is if Jethro's pH test is only registering 9.0 ppm ( JK Jason ) because that is as high as it can go. New cement could bring the pH up to 12-13 levels. With that said, as long as the fish aren't disintergrating or showing other signs of stress, I guess it's OK. To be sure I would get some pH paper ( lithmus paper ???) and check, it has the full range and only costs $1-2 at a hobby or school supply store. It only gives whole pH number increments, but you can tell if it is way above 9pH or not for piece of mind.

 

[koikeepr]

Right. If it's above 9, and it's just that the test can't register it--that's certainly something I would be concerned about.

 

[jason081180]

QUOTE=jason081180;41879]maybe its just me but i find if very confusing when you say 9.0 ppm. PH is not measured in ppm its just a number. like 7 or 8 there is no ppm. maybe I'm wrong but everything I've heard and learned in school never said ppm.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PH

Hey Jason, can't tell you why I put ppm after pH. You are right, I don't even know why I started doing that. Maybe from doing CO2 tests on planted tanks? I had kept records using pH and KH to figure out the saturation of CO2. I made my own chart and using ppm for both CO2 and KH and the pH result was in the ppm column. Guess I fooled myself into it? OR, just plain ole' screwed up:redface:[/QUOTE]

no problem Squidhead. glad i could help. i was a little worried about pointing it out not wanting to offend anyone. have a nice day.

 

[jethro13]

o.k. everbody this is what I have I rebuilt the beginning of my stream last summer to raise the water level in my top pond. I used mortar. So, it is about 10 mos. old. Thats probably the source. The test kit is made by Aquarium Pharmaceutical, Inc and is called Pond Care MASTER LIQUID TEST KIT for ponds it contains three color charts for fresh and saltwater nitrite, freshwater ammonia and wide range pH with 5.0 the lowest number (orange in color) up to 9.0 (dark blue in color) ANYWAY, I'm with koikeeper. I'm putting it to rest.

 

[Squidhead]

I use API test kits also. If the fish have not been affected by now, they should be OK. It may take a little longer for the calcium hyroxide to leach out with running water over it, believe it or not. The only reason why I know anything about this is I wanted to make DIY Live Rock for a Reef Aquarium and while researching it I stumbled across a website group that used cement and aragonite sand to create the rock portion. They found through experience that cureing it in stagnant water and just changing it every so often would work quicker then running fresh water over it constantly. Either way it will eventually cure and stabilize to the level of your tap water.

 

[JustMe]

I'm glad Koikeeper mentioned the plants et CO2,...back when I had 6 100gal aquariums all over my house, I actually injected CO2 into my tanks to try to lower the pH,...the CO2 however moves out of the water with surface movement,...add that to the limestone which creates very hard water and it is almost impossible to keep a consistently low pH without changing your water source,..ie R/O, I was so envious of those of you with soft acidic water!.....work with what you've got and next time seal the mortar!

 

[DoDad]

My ph is high out of the tap but my kh and gh are almost 0.
To raise kh I use baking soda. This will bring my kh up. I put enough in to raise the kh to 200. I use calcium chloride flake and Epsom salt to raise to 80.

 

[Squidhead]

I'm glad Koikeeper mentioned the plants et CO2,...back when I had 6 100gal aquariums all over my house, I actually injected CO2 into my tanks to try to lower the pH,...the CO2 however moves out of the water with surface movement,...add that to the limestone which creates very hard water and it is almost impossible to keep a consistently low pH without changing your water source,..ie R/O, I was so envious of those of you with soft acidic water!.....work with what you've got and next time seal the mortar!

I know I'm going off topic here but....... I also had, at my old home, high pH with a deep well. The water ran through underground streams that where in limestone. The well was deep enough in the rock of the mountain, that there was almost no oxygen in it. It came out of the well at a pH 5.3 to less then 5. When it aerated the pH jumped to the mid 8's. It also had low KH. I did CO2 injection for my plants. I also added some baking soda and epsom salts like DoDad to get my GH and KH to optimum for the plants and fish. I liked to keep my pH slightly acidic at 6.8. It was always consistant because I ended up with a pH controller for the CO2 dosing. The secret was keeping the surface agitation to a minimum and having an efficient CO2 reactor. CO2 diffusers are pretty useless, just like O2 the bubbles have to pop in the water to dissolve into the water column. Once you get a CO2 injection system set, your pH will be consistent with in .1pH........Not that any of you give a shizzle:lol:

 

[JustMe]

Squidhead you are bringing back memories,....I came up with all kinds of creative ways to keep that CO2 in the water! My main problem was my KH was sky high,..don't remember the number now,.but had one of those test kits with the little test tubes and you had to count the drops till the color change,..the bottle lasted about 4 tests! With KH that high I was fighting a loosing battle,...but I wanted my Neons to spawn,....finally broke down and bought R/O water, had to add the baking soda and epsom salts,.......when I think of the time and energy I spent on those tanks! Ponds are sooooooo much easier!