Peroxide

[Priscilla]

Questions around peroxide, a few mention using this to kill algae, I just saw a thread which says use 1 liter per 1000 gall.

Is this fish safe?
Is it plant safe?
What happens to the algae after it dies?
Does it float to the top? And then you scoop it out?
Does it kill all algae or just some of it? Thinking about the helpful kind on the sides to help filter water
What if I did a half dose? Just because I'm worried about harming the fish and plants.

My problem is right now the string algae is causing some upset with my plants. I put a pot in there it gets covered with algae and the plant does not grow or if it does, not very well. It seems like the algae is choking my plants. I was thinking of adding extra filtration, but as some of you know, I have been talking about this for some time now ..... when I will get around to it, I don't know.

 

[addy1]

I had just lilies in my arizona pond, with fish. The string algae would go crazy in June, overwhelm the pond. I put in 14 liters for my 14000 gallon pond. The string algae would be dead the next day, I would then scoop it out and it was gone until the next year. It did not bother the lilies, not sure what it would do to other plants. Maybe start with 1/2 that amount.

I also had good water flow and aeration while doing it.

 

[j.w]

I have heard that it turns brown and dies and some might still be attached to things and you might have to scrape or yank it off.

 

[JohnHuff]

My problem is right now the string algae is causing some upset with my plants.

I don't like putting any chemicals in my pond. Just pull it out.

 

[Priscilla]

I don't like chemicals either, but its really turning into a problem for the plants.

I have a new aerator coming, hoping that may help cut back on it.

 

[pugle1]

I don't like chemicals either, but its really turning into a problem for the plants.

I have a new aerator coming, hoping that may help cut back on it.

Buy the 3% peroxide from the drug store. 1 litre per 1000 gallons is a good dose. It's fish and plant safe, and I've been using it for a few years now. You may have heard of barley straw. If you add barley straw to your pond (pellet form or bales of it) it breaks down and releases natural hydrogen peroxide which kills the algae off. The bottled 3% from the drug store is the same thing. All hydrogen peroxide is, is H2O2 (water with an extra oxygen atom in the molecule) That extra oxygen atom doesn't like being attached to the water molecule and is released fairly easily. The "extra" oxygen in the water is what knocks down the algae, and when that extra atom is released, you end up with H2O + O (water plus oxygen). The algae doesn't like that extra oxygen in the water and simply turns brown and dies off. Most of it also lets go of what ever it's attached to and settles to the bottom. If your pond isn't too deep you just scoop it off the bottom and discard it (I compost mine). I treat my pond every four to six weeks as I have a lot of limestone in contact with the water, and string algae seems to love growing on that stuff.

My fish are 4 years in that water, and I've been using peroxide for the last 3 years. The fish and plants are thriving. Peroxide occurs in nature (one of the most abundant chemicals in the world) and although we call it a chemical, it's not in the sense that we think of chemicals like algecides and weed killers and automotive compounds. Harmless to your fish and plants as long as you don't overdose (we're talking higher concentrations of peroxide like the 35% or 50% industrial concentrates). Just use the 3% drug store stuff and you friends and plants will be just fine It's the ONLY "chemical" I add to my pond, and heck! we were just over-run with toad tadpoles this year.... now they're all hopping around the yard and as far as sensitivity to chemicals, I think they're even more fragile than the fish are.

The best thing to do is when you notice the string coming back, treat your pond before the string becomes too long again. In this way you can control it without having to deal with the big clumps like you will with the first treatment.

Hope that helps.

Paul

 

[addy1]

I bought mine at costco, cheap, each bottle a liter. This pond I have not needed it.

 

[Priscilla]

Buy the 3% peroxide from the drug store. 1 litre per 1000 gallons is a good dose. It's fish and plant safe, and I've been using it for a few years now. . Harmless to your fish and plants as long as you don't overdose (we're talking higher concentrations of peroxide like the 35% or 50% industrial concentrates). Just use the 3% drug store stuff and you friends and plants will be just fine

Wow! Thanks for the information! I will try it.

I do have a question around dosage - I don't know my exact gall. Pond is very odd shaped so difficult to calculate. We estimate its about 2200 gall - but its not exact. That's just using an average.

Should I start with a smaller amount, like 1 liter and see what happens? Or do I need a stronger dosage to make a difference? In other words, its not like salt where it just hangs around till you do a water change?

Hope that makes sense. My head is all over the place right now.

 

[addy1]

It does not hang around, start with a light dose until you know what dose works for you.

 

[pugle1]

Hi Priscilla. 2 L won't hurt. My pond / bog is now about 2000 gal (estimate) and early on I had really strong string algae bloom. I super-dosed with 6 L. All was fine, and with 2L you won't harm anything. And addy is right, it breaks down into water and oxygen quickly as soon as it comes in contact with any organic compounds like fish waste and dead plant matter. The only difference between using the bottled 3% stuff and barley straw is that the barley straw takes a lot longer ( weeks ) to break down and start releasing the peroxide. And too, the bottled peroxide is cheap. Barley straw also leaves a lot of sludge that needs to be cleaned up.

Paul

 

[pugle1]

Sorry. I should have added this.... I don't know whether or not if it kills off the short (good) algae, but if it does, it seems to recover quite quickly. My last treatment was about a week ago, and my short algae seems to be just fine.

 

[crsublette]

Questions around peroxide, a few mention using this to kill algae, I just saw a thread which says use 1 liter per 1000 gall.

1) Is this fish safe?
2) Is it plant safe?
3) What happens to the algae after it dies?
Does it float to the top? And then you scoop it out?
4) Does it kill all algae or just some of it? Thinking about the helpful kind on the sides to help filter water
5) What if I did a half dose? Just because I'm worried about harming the fish and plants.

My problem is right now the string algae is causing some upset with my plants. I put a pot in there it gets covered with algae and the plant does not grow or if it does, not very well. It seems like the algae is choking my plants. I was thinking of adding extra filtration, but as some of you know, I have been talking about this for some time now ..... when I will get around to it, I don't know.

1) Is this fish safe?

Yes, if done in moderation. If you are concerned, then obtain a low concentration hydrogen peroxide (H202) test strip kit. You do not want a noticeable amount of H2O2 to remain in the water for longer than 24 hours.

To neutralize excess H2O2, then you can dose the water with incredibly safe and healthy sodium thiosulfate (ST). ST (or a variant of it) is most often used as the main ingredient in water de-chlorinator products to neutralize the chlorine and also neutralize the chlorine within chloramine. This stuff is incredibly cheap and very safe. Post#17 in thread "adding water" should provide some clarity about ST.

Needs very little ST to neutralize excess H2O2. Around about 1.00 part of ST to 0.55 parts of active H2O2.

After 24 hours of dosing with H2O2 and if you are still concerned there might be some lingering H2O2, then good enough to just throw in a handful of ST crystals in a bucket of water to dissolve it then pour it around the pond. If it is a quite large pond, the might need to do some calculations.


2) Is it plant safe?

Extremely.


3) What happens to the algae after it dies?
Does it float to the top? And then you scoop it out?

As others mentioned, just floats to top or might be a little "clingy" that a gently knock will remove it.


4) Does it kill all algae or just some of it? Thinking about the helpful kind on the sides to help filter water

Hydrogen peroxide is what is called a "non-selective" broad herbicide and microbicide. It will attack absolutely anything that is organic. This is not the same to say it will damage or kill anything since everything has different tolerances.

Personally, I always bypass my bio-filters when using any type of oxidizer due to my paranoia, but you might be fine not bypassing it.


5) What if I did a half dose? Just because I'm worried about harming the fish and plants.

That'd be fine, but, then, remember, half the dose is half the effectiveness.

 

[crsublette]

I have found that anything around 18~30 ounces per 1,000 gallons (which is 1.8~3 ounces per 100 gallons) is quite safe. 1 Litre per 1,000 gallons would be fine as well.

However, ultimately, the effectiveness dose depends on how "clean" your pond is due to how it is an indiscriminate attacker of all organics. So, the hydrogen peroxide could be "used up" before it has a chance to reach the algae. If your pond is quite dirty, with very noticeable amount of settled decomposing debris (etc.), then you might have to do a higher dose.


Stick to the lower end, with more frequent doses, if you think you have significantly underestimated your pond volume gallonage.

For these things, this is why knowing your pond volume gallonage is incredibly important.


There are 2 methods for doing an educated "guess"-timation to determine your pond's water gallons, which are pretty close to accurate with a low variant when done correctly.

1) How do I calculate water volume with salt?

(( eve nthough fine when calculating pond volume. However, anytime I mentioned salt, I have to also reference post#3 in thread, "how much salt is safe" ))


2) Calculating pond volume - Baking soda method

 

[crsublette]

Buy the 3% peroxide from the drug store. 1 litre per 1000 gallons is a good dose. It's fish and plant safe, and I've been using it for a few years now. 1) You may have heard of barley straw. If you add barley straw to your pond (pellet form or bales of it) it breaks down and releases natural hydrogen peroxide which kills the algae off. The bottled 3% from the drug store is the same thing. 2) All hydrogen peroxide is, is H2O2 (water with an extra oxygen atom in the molecule) That extra oxygen atom doesn't like being attached to the water molecule and is released fairly easily. The "extra" oxygen in the water is what knocks down the algae, and when that extra atom is released, you end up with H2O + O (water plus oxygen). The algae doesn't like that extra oxygen in the water and simply turns brown and dies off. Most of it also lets go of what ever it's attached to and settles to the bottom. If your pond isn't too deep you just scoop it off the bottom and discard it (I compost mine). I treat my pond every four to six weeks as I have a lot of limestone in contact with the water, and string algae seems to love growing on that stuff.

My fish are 4 years in that water, and I've been using peroxide for the last 3 years. The fish and plants are thriving. Peroxide occurs in nature (one of the most abundant chemicals in the world) and although we call it a chemical, it's not in the sense that we think of chemicals like algecides and weed killers and automotive compounds. Harmless to your fish and plants as long as you don't overdose (we're talking higher concentrations of peroxide like the 35% or 50% industrial concentrates). Just use the 3% drug store stuff and you friends and plants will be just fine It's the ONLY "chemical" I add to my pond, and heck! we were just over-run with toad tadpoles this year.... now they're all hopping around the yard and as far as sensitivity to chemicals, I think they're even more fragile than the fish are.

The best thing to do is when you notice the string coming back, treat your pond before the string becomes too long again. In this way you can control it without having to deal with the big clumps like you will with the first treatment.

Hope that helps.

Paul

1) You may have heard of barley straw. If you add barley straw to your pond (pellet form or bales of it) it breaks down and releases natural hydrogen peroxide which kills the algae off.

Yep yep.

A better way to obtain this benefit from barley is to feed it to fish so that their limited digestive process speeds up the bacterial decomposition. This is talked about in post#4 in thread "Montmorillonite clay question".


2) All hydrogen peroxide is, is H2O2 (water with an extra oxygen atom in the molecule) That extra oxygen atom doesn't like being attached to the water molecule and is released fairly easily. The "extra" oxygen in the water is what knocks down the algae, and when that extra atom is released, you end up with H2O + O (water plus oxygen). The algae doesn't like that extra oxygen in the water and simply turns brown and dies off.

Almost... though, not correct.

More of a case that the reactive freed oxygen radicals does not like the algae.

When H2O2 dissociates, it creates H2O + - O. Negative O is reactive oxygen and is the reason why H2O2 is refered to as an oxidizer. Oxidizers not only adds oxygen to the water, but also "dings" any organic matter that contacts it.


H2O2 also can significantly "ding" fish's gills if it is not dosed slowly and spread out around the parameter of the pond.

Unfortunately, gill damage is permanent and not easy to detect unless you actually know what to look for. Gill damage is really noticeable once the fish grows to become a larger fish, unless the damage was quite severe.

The only time this would happen is if way too much H2O2 was used or if the fish swam directly through the stuff during dosing.

 

[crsublette]

I also highly recommend hydrogen peroxide, along with increased aeration, while folk are cleaning their ponds, that is if there is fish in pond during cleaning.

During cleaning, there is an increase of sulfides introduced to the water and not all of the sulfides will be "safe". The harmful sulfides, most commonly referred to as hydrogen sulfide gas, is what can potentially kill the fish quite fast if they swim directly through this stuff. However, with good aeration and oxidation, quite unlikely this will happen.

For the techies out here, here is a good document that talks about this... The Use of Hydrogen Peroxide for the Oxidation of Sulfur Chemical Wastes.

Personally, I would use a low concentration hydrogen peroxide (H2O2) test, as referenced in an earlier post above, while cleaning so I can maintain a quite small charge of H2O2 while cleaning. If the test shows zero, then add a small dose of H2O2 until done cleaning. Once done cleaning, then do a slow major water change of around 40~80%. If you are still considered, then add some sodium thiosulfate, as referenced in an earlier post above.