koi resting bottom still eating

[nellis1989]

@Lisak1 I lost two fish within the first two weeks the 3rd I lost after the quarantine period, I was about to put him in the pond and noticed the ulcer and tried to patch him up with a koi health kit. The pond liner is lapped over the edge and then comes down the hill about 6inch, my yard was uneven so we wanted to be sure the pond was the highest point in the yard so we took the sand from the hole and built a hill....my yard is 100% sand. The deepest part of the pond is definitely 6ft deep....the shelves are kinda like steps they are as follows...shallow end 2ft d x 2.5 L, middle shelf 3.5 ft x 3.5ft and the deepest part is 6ft x 3ft.....it is a large drop off and not sloped to each shelf.....we wanted the koi to ave a safe place for winter as ny winters can get cold. Hubby originally wanted to dig to 8 ft.

 

[Tula]

https://www.koitotheworld.com/blogs...ortance-of-carbonate-hardness-kh-in-your-pond

This article has some good information on KH.

 

[nellis1989]

i went out this morning and the little 4inch koi was hovering at the surface by my hornwort patch. I scared him when i went out so i dont know if he was eating or what. swimming normally and not gasping for air. swarmed with the others to feed.
@MitchM i forgot to add current phosphates .25

 

[nellis1989]

@Tula i have read the article before and thank you for posting encase i hadnt. I also read that i should try to raise kh slowly along with any other parameters and have slowly raised kh from 0 drops (tap water) to 5 drops. I bought some calcium chloride as another koi keeper suggested to be here tuesday and I will add a little of that mixed with pond water to the pond until i get the 10 drops or so i need.

 

[nellis1989]

i watched them for about an hour this morning the little guy is the only one feeling the need to rest on the bottom, clamped fin on one side....all others when they did rest stayed for a second fins out and then swam again. I am afraid i might have missed something with his scrape and scope but dont want to do it again so soon for fear of hurting his slime coat to much in his weakened state.

 

[GBBUDD]

the block is on top of the liner

pond itself is raised above my entire yard

nellis says theres a pitch away from the pond so case closed. Picture does not appear so in the back left it's obvious in the front of the photo

 

[Mmathis]

@nellis1989 How long has your pond actually been up and running, and when in relation to that time, did you start adding fish? How and for how long did you quarantine?

 

[MitchM]

Usually sodium bicarbonate (baking soda) is used to raise KH and magnesium sulphate (Epsom salt) is used to raise GH. What are you using to raise these 2 levels?
I would not be using calcium chloride.

Your pond would probably also benefit from a mesh bag filled with oyster shells.

 

[MitchM]

@nellis1989 , keep in mind there are two approaches to keeping koi.
Dedicated Koi Ponds (DKP) and natural ponds. Koi (and all fish) live longer in natural ponds.
Dedicated koi ponds require micromanagement of the water quality which leads to more a more stressful life for the fish and as a result they have a shorter lifespan.

 

[Lisak1]

@nellis1989 - I'm happy to see you hanging in there with us - I know it's a lot of questions and information to take in at one time. This is a friendly, helpful group - you won't find any harsh judgement here for any mistakes or missteps along the way. We all learn as we go!

By the way, I'm glad your husband didn't go 8 feet deep - there is a point at which a hole can need engineering to make sure it doesn't collapse. Of course, what do I know - maybe your husband IS an engineer! haha!

 

[Tara]

Hello, sorry you're having these issues. I had the same problems a few weeks ago with my pond water, one fish appeared stressed and quite ill, ph had dropped to just under 7, next morning 6.5 then remained there until very late in the night then had dropped lower to 6. I did remove the koi that was so sluggish, and easy to catch. I took a sample of water to a few places to confirm the tests were correct. My pond has a waterfall, and on the opposite side there is a deep end 4 ft, what I did, is I called a wildlife pond office, and asked if the heavy rain could be the cause, I was told it's possible. Temperature drop with four inches of rain of a lower ph, lack of aeration in the deep end and green algae that had died of could have raised the co2 and dropped the ph, I did add a lot of aeration to the deep end, removed the fish and waited. Ph is back between 7 and 8. Test on the rain water was about 5.5. Like you my pond is relatively new, so plant development is not mature. I did take the advice with a grain of salt, as the person I wished to speak to is no longer there. You have a uv on both filters to kill algae, and a small waterfall for 6 feet of water, so as a novice myself not sure if that would be an issue or not. But whatever happens I do hope you figure things out, and your fish improve.

 

[Mmathis]

@MitchM I’m not trying to start anything here — just trying to learn. I was never good at chemistry, so I only have a very basic understanding. You are saying NOT to use calcium chloride, but the folks on KOIPHEN are telling the OP TO use calcium chloride. I know, they tend to micromanage, as you said.....but I don’t understand the differences and I’m confused....... In basic language (assume I don’t know any chemistry), please explain why CaCl would or would not be a good choice.

 

[MitchM]

No problem at all.
Calcium chloride adds chlorides to the water which can add up over time.
I think a safer way to add calcium to a pond is koi clay, or calcium bentonite or montmorillonite clay.
Calcium chloride can also react with baking soda and form a white precipitate.
And, calcium chloride produces an exothermic reaction when mixed with water (it gives off heat), which could burn any fish it comes in contact with. You could mix it in a separate container to prevent that.
Clay has the added benefit of binding phosphate which will help with algae control.
Dedicated koi pond keepers don’t mind the extra chloride because they usually have added salt anyway.
It’s just not what I would do. Everyone is free of course to run their pond the way they prefer.

 

[nellis1989]

@MitchM I have oyster shell with crushed coral in my waterfall.
@Mmathis I started the pond three months ago added fish after a few weeks I quarantined in a 200gallon pool for 2 weeks before adding them to the pond.

unfortunately my 4 inch fish was dead today. I took a scrape and scope of the body and gills.
I found a tick like creatures all black.
I think their was also costia but i could not get a accurate picture as i think my telescope is not that great.
no sign of any other parasite.

 

[nellis1989]

@MitchM i have been doing potassium treatments and they are supposed to kill costia.
the little guy was stuck in my plant ring for a day or so i couldnt find him. I think this led to a weakened condition and the costia took over. Nothing in my scrape and scope looked like any of the parasites i found online except a large mass of moving dots that I couldnt get a good look at.

all other fish are looking fine.

I have had heavy rainfall lately.