In need of help.. unable to identify fish problems

[Koiguyjoe]

I had 4 gold fish losses in the last 2 days.. and 8in Goldie has some discoloration on the top of his head.. pH is a little higher than normal at 8 & everything else is OK as far as i can tell.. removed pond plants, used a pH neutralizer 7 and did a 20% water change.

First pic is of the white on his head.
Second pic is of fish when healthy..

Any feedback?!!?

 

[Meyer Jordan]

Not the pH. Do not try to adjust it.
When you say everything else is OK, what do you mean? Give numeric test results.

 

[Koiguyjoe]

See photo

 

[Meyer Jordan]

A little more information, please. Size of pond (gallons). Number, size and type of fish. Pump size (GPH). Filtration.
Have any pond treatments been added recently? Have any new fish been added recently?

 

[Koiguyjoe]

Pond is just over 1000usgal
Pumps 600gph
1500gal bio filter
Pond plants, dwarf cattail, hardy water Lily's, water hychianths, a few others I'm not exactly sure of the names..
7 koi
2 shubumkin
1 large goldfish (the one pictured in question)
4 real tiny comets

The only treatments are API "algaefix" and API "water conditioner" when I add water...

 

[Mmathis]

How big are the koi? That sounds like a lot for 1000 gal. unless the koi are very small.

 

[CometKeith]

Sorry about your goldfish. I can give you a very generic answer. Typically disease happens when the water quality is poor. Poor water quality can be caused by excess ammonia, nitrite, or nitrates (bad stuff). Also poorly oxygenated water can cause all types of problems too and make it hard for fish to breathe through their gills. There is something called cycling a pond. This is when there are sufficient number of beneficial bacterial (bb) that inhabits a pond and filters. When enough bb build up they synthesize the bad stuff that makes fish sick. Once you learn how to cycle a pond then rarely do your fish get sick because the water is healthy. Typically newer ponds are not cycled and that is why only a few small fish should be added until it has been cycled. It's easy to see when it's cycled because a lot of the algae will disappear almost entirely overnight. Also healthy water is not the same as clear or clean water. Your pond can have lots of algae and be very healthy and in contrast your pond water can look clean but be toxic to your fish with high concentrations of ammonia or nitrate. Also as others have referenced when the bioload is too big it makes it hard for the bb to keep up and dangerous elements can build up in the pond. That is why it's always better to start with less fish and add gradually rather than starting with too many and ending up with less which is not fun

 

[Faebinder]

Those test parameters dont suggest water problems but you're definitely over stocked if those koi are big. You're PH is fine btw.

Your filter, algae and plants may be doing a good job keeping things clean.... Killing the algae with algae fix may have done this.. The algae may have been keeping the water clean + adding oxygen with the overstocking you got. I doubt it's an oxygen issue though cause your koi would go first.
I am suspecting a fungal infection secondary to dissolved organics after you killed the algae. If you are seeing fungal infections on any of your fish, isolate and start treating. I would keep up with pond water changes until you find a way to reduce your stocking problem. You can make a bog to help filter things more.

Too much algae solutions:
- remove fish
- add plants whether floating or making a bog
- do frequent water changes.

Do not kill the algae.

 

[Koiguyjoe]

The koi are not big koi. Mostly babies.. the biggest is maybe 5in. I have many floating hyacinths, a lily, and 3 small potted water plants... I have 2 air stones running, a fountain in which has the filtered water coming thru, and another fountain for show and extra movement.. this is my second year with the pond... I did the micro fibre spring treatment for 4weeks and added other beneficial bacteria...I have decided tho to no longer use chemicals such as algaefix and accuclear.... only water conditioner during water changes... I'll let the plants, and the movement, and the fish do the natural thing... I haven't lost anymore fish, but the large Goldie is almost all white now.. I'll attach another pic that I took tonight... so as I'm still very new to this, any and all suggestions,and feedback are welcomed... i love hearing from you guys...

Also I did notice the Goldie not eating for a couple days, but has since eaten again.. I feed them a variety of pond sticks, blood worms, and once in a while, live brine shrimp....

 

[HARO]

Goldfish CAN change colour. I wouldn't worry about it.
John

 

[Mmathis]

Goldfish CAN change colour. I wouldn't worry about it.
John

Was just going to say the same thing about color changes. They DO change color, and the pic that is shown looks like a transition phase -- I have a few like that right now.

 

[CometKeith]

I agree about no chemicals. I never use chemicals or additives other than water treatment and my fish have no disease or sickness whatsoever. The only thing I have ever done in the past is a salt bath for a fish, but literally I take the fish out and give it the salt bath for 10 minutes and put it back. I think the algae does a great job of converting ammonia etc to less harmful byproducts and by getting rid of it and in the absence of good bb you are leaving your fish defenseless. It's interesting that many goldfish farm ponds are covered with algae and have no other means of filtration or cleaning. Re color change: Some of my prettiest fish started black then to orange then to white or some variation. I always have about a dozen black goldfish in my pond and slowly they turn other colors. It seems it is natural selection because the goldfish that start out dark and then turn lighter later survive better when they are fry than light colored fry because of their ability to hide .