DO YOU HAVE A SIEVE FILTER?

[Waterbug]

WB, how is adding media to the tank going to make it fluidized? The media would just get sucked into the pump.

Depending on how the tank was configured, amount of flow, I think you might get some movement. But a container for the media might be needed.

I'm thinking that a DIY sieve can be done another way, by rotational or centrifugal energy.

Sounds like a RDF, Google "rotating drum filter koi". Complex, but interesting.

Apart from that I am very sure that a DIY regular sieve filter can be easily made with a rectangular box and a piece of cheesecloth or some other material that can be thrown away when dirty and replaced. You don't really need a micro filter.

Fabric has a tendency to catch debris and keep it in the water column. The purpose of a sieve is to remove the debris from the water column as quickly as possible by pushing the debris down the screen, out of the water.

In my humble opinion a pump fed sieve filter is ok because the muck at the bottom of the pond is quite fine anyway.

In combination with a BD and TPRs the idea is no muck ever forms. Fish poop is removed before it breaks down into fine muck.

 

[crsublette]

Ya can also buy retro-fitted drains, but I am told the drains may not be as effective if your pond bottom was not properly designed to work with a drain.

WB, how is adding media to the tank going to make it fluidized? The media would just get sucked into the pump.

I'll take a shot at the question.

I figure ya would place two angle down sloped shelve and, where the two shelves meet at a point, this is where ya would have a good aerator blowing up. The slopes would bring the kaldness material down to the aerator where the kaldness would get blown up and so on. The two slopes would also have to have a good number of holes in it to allow water to flow to the pump below the sloped shelves.

In my humble opinion a pump fed sieve filter is ok because the muck at the bottom of the pond is quite fine anyway.

This is what I am curious about ...

How fine of a muck could a sieve practically filter ??

I figure a fella could have a 3 or 5 stage sieve where the bottom stage would be the finest material.

Sounds like a RDF, Google "rotating drum filter koi". Complex, but interesting.

Heh, saw one of those on a japan koi club website. Looks pretty intense.

In combination with a BD and TPRs the idea is no muck ever forms. Fish poop is removed before it breaks down into fine muck.

Ok. gotta ask, seen the BD and TPR acronyms several times and can't figure them out. I am guessing "BD" stands for "bottom drain" and can't figure what "TPR" stands for. What's the deal?

 

[don't ask]

TPR is Tangential Pond Return. the water is returned to the pond at an angle so that it sends the water along the pond wall instead of straight ahead.

 

[crsublette]

Thank ya much !! don't want to hijack this thread; quickly mentioning, if anyone reading as clueless as I was about TPR, found an explanation about how a TPR works.

 

[JohnHuff]

Depending on how the tank was configured, amount of flow, I think you might get some movement. But a container for the media might be needed.

Ya, the only way I think it would work would be a water wheel where the inflow drives the vanes and the media with it.

Fabric has a tendency to catch debris and keep it in the water column.

Ya, it's not exactly the same as the real sieve, that's why I said throw away or clean when dirty.

 

[Mmathis]

I don't have a bottom drain, so would need a pump-fed version. Are they effective?

 

[Waterbug]

How fine of a muck could a sieve practically filter ??

Not effective at all. Sieve filters remove crap before it becomes muck...that's really the entire point to having a sieve. Anyone with muck in the bottom of a pond and adds a sieve thinking it's going to remove muck is going to be disappointed.

Most people seem to start with a 300 micron sieve but then seem to want to move to a 200 micron. Both of these sizes relate directly to the size of Koi feces which is the primary target of sieves.

 

[Waterbug]

I don't have a bottom drain, so would need a pump-fed version. Are they effective?

Not really. I would guess 90% of what a sieve would normally remove would be too small after going through a pump. But, 10% is better than nothing.

Sieves can also be used in skimmers, instead of a basket.

 

[crsublette]

Is a sieve filter with a 60 micron material doable??

Rotary drum filters use much smaller filter material but also they use water jets to clean off the muck.

 

[don't ask]

wow, 60 microns? that will certainly catch almost anything in the water would be my guess.. you may have to rinse of screen more often even with water flowing downhill.. not sure haven't heard of anyone using that fine of a mesh

 

[crsublette]

Yeah, that's what I was wondering about with the manual hosing down part

 

[Waterbug]

I also have never heard of anyone using anything under 200 microns. Normally people seem to be using sand filters for the fine stuff.

I don't think the issue is the screen clogging with debris when you get down into the tiny sizes as much is it is with water having a difficult time getting thru. I think you would just have to make the screen area larger, maybe engineer a new shape.

Ya'll keep talking about manually hosing off these screens...I assume you understand these don't need to be manually hosed off...but don't believe it? I mean you can hose them off if you like, if you want a spotless screen, or if it's easier.

Assuming a good screen of course, no algae grow, etc. If something like cheesecloth is used that would be a different matter, and that also wouldn't be a sieve filter.

 

[don't ask]

waterbug i may have not said it correctly but what you said about water not passing thru a 60 micron screen easily after some use is why i mentioned hosing it off

 

[Waterbug]

Not sure we're talking about the same thing. I mean with 100% clean water and a 100% clean screen the water has a hard time getting through the screen. As the holes get smaller there is more material per square inch blocking water. So a water drop might have to bounce more times until it hit an opening.

I assumed you were talking about little bits of crap clogging holes and it having to be hosed off.

 

[crsublette]

Yep

Figure rotary drum filters have all sorts of extra mechanics allowing to work with such a small material.