CW's Back Yard Water Garden Begins!

[combatwombat]

Which is the big vs small?

The small one is the one in the foreground. As originally planned, the little land bridge between them will be submerged when water level is at planned height. I will get my fancy surveying tools out again and shoot some elevations before moving forward, but I think I'd have to raise that end up a little higher than I'd like to get even a 6" drop. Think it would end up looking a little funny trying to get that elevation, and I can put waterfalls elsewhere by tee-ing off of the main line to the bog, so I still have lots of options.

 

[addy1]

but I think I'd have to raise that end up a little higher than I'd like to get even a 6" drop. Think it would end up looking a little funny trying to get that elevation,

Once it is a bog it will not look weird to be higher than the pond. You won't be looking at water next to water , instead pea gravel and plants next to water. With some rock edges, plants slight slope out into the yard it will blend right in. imho

 

[combatwombat]

Half-finished pond looks a lot better covered in snow.

 

[combatwombat]

Hi Pond friends. Back with a little update. First 10-ton load of boulders has arrived, so I'm ready to start rocking! But first, gotta drain the whole darn thing. Bought a 4000 gal/hr utility pump + 100 feet of 2" pool discharge hose for about $110 on Amazon. Should make quick work of draining the pit and the pump will be good for an interim backup if the main ever fails.

Also, 3 months of winter was enough time for me to come to terms with the idea of flipping the orientation of the intake & wetland. Major pro = don't have to gobble up any more yard to make an adequate sized wetland filter. My daughter is almost two, and I can tell she is going to need every inch of space I can give her to run around. Major con: no waterfall. @addy1 previously suggested building a bigger berm to get a small drop from the bog. Haven't ruled that out, but I really can't see making that section taller without it looking weird when it's done.

Thinking about planting some decorative urns/spheres in the bog to get the sound of running water, and also a bit of oxygenation. Not sure if that would be enough to oxygenate the whole pond, though. Probably still need an aeration system.

Next steps =

1. Drain the pond.
2. Rock the bottom two shelves.
3. Dig out the new intake bay and the remainder of the repurposed wetland area.

 

[brokensword]

Hi Pond friends. Back with a little update. First 10-ton load of boulders has arrived, so I'm ready to start rocking! But first, gotta drain the whole darn thing. Bought a 4000 gal/hr utility pump + 100 feet of 2" pool discharge hose for about $110 on Amazon. Should make quick work of draining the pit and the pump will be good for an interim backup if the main ever fails.

Also, 3 months of winter was enough time for me to come to terms with the idea of flipping the orientation of the intake & wetland. Major pro = don't have to gobble up any more yard to make an adequate sized wetland filter. My daughter is almost two, and I can tell she is going to need every inch of space I can give her to run around. Major con: no waterfall. @addy1 previously suggested building a bigger berm to get a small drop from the bog. Haven't ruled that out, but I really can't see making that section taller without it looking weird when it's done.

Thinking about planting some decorative urns/spheres in the bog to get the sound of running water, and also a bit of oxygenation. Not sure if that would be enough to oxygenate the whole pond, though. Probably still need an aeration system.

Next steps =

1. Drain the pond.
2. Rock the bottom two shelves.
3. Dig out the new intake bay and the remainder of the repurposed wetland area.

View attachment 136893

if you're going to have the wetland filter on the opposite side, how do you plan on the 'upflowing' bog water getting back to the pond? Most make this a gravity fed system thus you'd have to elevate the bog at least 6" higher than the pond. Doing this will give you the waterfall. IMO, the waterfalls I have are intrinsicaly tied to how much enjoyment I get out of my pond. There's just nothing like watching and hearing the cascade. You should think about a placement for a future waterfall, should you think you're missing out too. You can always add one later if you plan ahead; all you'd need is another smaller liner that would overlap and feed back into the pond and underline (more like a bowl shape) your rock waterfall.

Not exactly sure how you're planning this bog but typically, as the gravel gets clogged with roots and pond particulate, the water level rises, so you want to make sure your bog water level is at least 4-6" lower than the liner surrounding it.

 

[GBBUDD]

the waterfalls I have are intrinsically tied to how much enjoyment I get out of my pond

ABSOLUYLY , i would never build a pond and bog without a waterfall or lights . Dig the bog deeper to get material to build the sides up or you could always use lumber. theres not a terrible amount of strength needed at the top foot of a bog

 

[combatwombat]

how do you plan on the 'upflowing' bog water getting back to the pond?

The water level of the pond and bog will be the same. So, the water from the bog will simply flow out into the pond without dropping. Check out the video if you can. I talk about it a bit in there.

IMO, the waterfalls I have are intrinsicaly tied to how much enjoyment I get out of my pond

I can understand that. I don't think it will affect my enjoyment much, though. I mentioned in the video that I initially planned for there to be no waterfall, and only added one later when I saw that most people had one. I am thinking I can also add some fountain elements inside the bog (like those urns/spheres that Aquascape makes) that will achieve the sound of running water.

And if that proves not enough, there is space behind the camera where I could add a 10' stream/falls that runs down into the bog if I choose to do so in the future.

Not exactly sure how you're planning this bog but typically, as the gravel gets clogged with roots and pond particulate, the water level rises, so you want to make sure your bog water level is at least 4-6" lower than the liner surrounding it.

This won't be an issue if the water level in the bog is even with the rest of the pond. "Overflow" will simply flow out into the rest of the pond.

Dig the bog deeper to get material to build the sides

I haven't ruled it out entirely, but elevating the sides of that new bog area more, would the space appear too unnatural in my opinion.

 

[TheFishGuy]

I am not going to get into the technical side of things, but I will say it looks like its coming together well!

And I do love the urn/sphere idea, you should look at some of aquascapes products such as the stacked slate urns, those are pretty great.

 

[brokensword]

The water level of the pond and bog will be the same. So, the water from the bog will simply flow out into the pond without dropping. Check out the video if you can. I talk about it a bit in there.

I watched, hence my question. I think you'll be surprised; if your bog 'edge' surrounding is the same height as your pond, and you're planning on the liner behind everything being level, the water will rise higher than your gravel surface before it starts then to push across to the pond. When this happens, you may get wicking or overflowing the sides of your bog perimeter. At least plan on having more rock/border height which means more liner height on that end. I know in my case, I didn't see this happening and as it was my first bog, didn't leave enough liner to raise it higher as the water level in the bog rose due to the clogging. If your bog is going to be active and thrive, I expect the water level there to indeed rise.

I can understand that. I don't think it will affect my enjoyment much, though. I mentioned in the video that I initially planned for there to be no waterfall, and only added one later when I saw that most people had one. I am thinking I can also add some fountain elements inside the bog (like those urns/spheres that Aquascape makes) that will achieve the sound of running water.

And if that proves not enough, there is space behind the camera where I could add a 10' stream/falls that runs down into the bog if I choose to do so in the future.

Oh, I got the 'no preplanned waterfall' part; I'm hinting that it's something you'll regret having later even if you don't know yet what you're missing. Easy to plan for the future in case you get bored with the pond and want to add a new feature.

Fountains et al are good too--they add a different dimension. I used to have a 'spitter' but it disturbed the surface more than I liked (interfered with seeing the fish clearly!) though I think kids would love it!

It's all good; just looking at your project and noting items for consideration and reasons for them.

 

[combatwombat]

@TheFishGuy: Thanks. I've been eyeing some of Aquascape's pieces. They are kind of ridiculously expensive for what they are, though (plastic/resin). If I can't find a suitable substitute, I'll probably buy them anyway.

@brokensword: Got it. No worries. You may be right that I'll end up wishing I had a waterfall. Luckily, I have 3-4 alternate areas where I think I can incorporate that later if I decide to. One of them is actually really cool. Could start under the deck, flow in front of the stairs (behind me in the video) and drop into the center of the pond. A little bridge at the bottom of the stairs to connect to a (yet to be installed) patio.

As for the bog design, I think I see where we're missing each other. My plan is for there to be 2-4" of standing water in the bog at all times. Here's an example I just pulled from Google Images. Don't pay any attention to the bog design other than the water level. Just how the water level is even with water level in the bog. With this kind design, the bog is just part of the pond. I don't think there is any way for water to leak out of the bog without also leaking out of the whole pond. As long as the whole pond has a few inches of extra liner, it would take another 1000 gallons or so above planned water level to start over flowing. Let me know if this makes sense and/or you see it differently.

 

[brokensword]

@TheFishGuy: Thanks. I've been eyeing some of Aquascape's pieces. They are kind of ridiculously expensive for what they are, though (plastic/resin). If I can't find a suitable substitute, I'll probably buy them anyway.

@brokensword: Got it. No worries. You may be right that I'll end up wishing I had a waterfall. Luckily, I have 3-4 alternate areas where I think I can incorporate that later if I decide to. One of them is actually really cool. Could start under the deck, flow in front of the stairs (behind me in the video) and drop into the center of the pond. A little bridge at the bottom of the stairs to connect to a (yet to be installed) patio.

As for the bog design, I think I see where we're missing each other. My plan is for there to be 2-4" of standing water in the bog at all times. Here's an example I just pulled from Google Images. Don't pay any attention to the bog design other than the water level.. Just how the water level is even with water level in the bog. With this kind design, the bog is just part of the pond. I don't think there is any way for water to leak out of the bog without also leaking out of the whole pond. As long as the whole pond has a few inches of extra liner, it would take another 1000 gallons or so above planned water level to start over flowing. Let me know if this makes sense and/or you see it differently.

View attachment 136897

(edit)
Okay, scratch much of my explanation below (I'm leaving it for any newbies that might happen by) as I didn't see you DO have piping under the bog. This rise will happen, as I stated below. And as Bagsmom says, don't use soil as it'll not allow the bacteria to do their job effectivley. Use gravel, pea size.


Also, you're going to probably have a lot of algae growth on anything submerged in this bog design; I know when my water level rises over the gravel, nice thick algae takes hold. It is best if you can keep this surface area open for the rise as this maximizes the filtering area and avoids channeling. Too, you may not have the water movement you want because with too much water open to your pond (the 2-4" referenced), water will take the path of least resistance and most will undercut your top layer of bog substrate.
(original)

so in essence, you're planting a 'real' bog. Meaning, you are NOT going to have any upflow from the bog bottom, correct? If so, you're really just planting marginals and will not experience the filtering we generally boast about. ( A real bog depends on a large surface area, laminar flow toward the main water basin, and lots of plants.) You need to pull water from all over (or have it directed to a point where you can pull) and then send it UNDER the gravel. When you do this, the water column of the pond then is pushed (important here as your design has only passive manipulation if any at all) past the colonizing bacteria and also toward your plants. Without this push, you'll be depending on convection type currents to reach your bog and with the wall between, that isn't really going to happen.

Reconsider a Y piece on your pump, send it through flex pvc to a manifold under your bog, and then the push will rise and filtration will be maximized. AND when you do this, my above comments come into play. Now you have a force pushing water higher than your pond, hence needing the sides to be higher to contain this rise.

If you are going to have other filtration, then what I wrote above is inconsequential. If this IS your main/only filtration, reconsider your design so you get the effect a bog can give.

 

[bagsmom]

I know most of the bog/wetland filters I have seen use gravel and not soil. It seems like the flow of water would end up pushing all your bog soil out into the pond. Don't you think?

 

[bagsmom]

Oh wait - maybe your bog is not your filtration, which could be different. I am planning on having a wetland filter for my pond, so I am following this discussion with great interest!

 

[combatwombat]

@bagsmom, @brokensword: I can see that I made a big mistake posting that example image. I went back and bolded the important part of that post for clarity: DISREGARD EVERYTHING ABOUT THAT DESIGN EXCEPT FOR THE WATER LEVEL.

If I were a little less lazy, I'd draw my own example.

The bog will be Aquascape style wetland. I'm sure you've seen it a million times on Youtube. Here's the Aquascape promo video. A DIY version is described in detail here.

That is the design of my bog/wetland filter.

@brokensword: Are you saying that, because the water level will be over the top of the substrate that water percolating up through the bog won't percolate up at the back, and all will just migrate forward? I don't think that's necessarily correct (or different from channeling issues in an elevated bog), but maybe that's not what you're saying.

In any case, I've seen a number of Team Aquascape videos where they build just like what I am proposing—a wetland within the pond. Maybe I'll try to call up Ed Beaulieu and see if he'll talk to me about it.

 

[bagsmom]

OK, cool! I get it now!!! Wouldn't you LOVE to have a day or a week or a month to hang out with Ed Beaulieu?????