CW's Back Yard Water Garden Begins!

[Lisak1]

@combatwombat - we put a ball valve just ahead of where the main line drops down into the bog. We can shut that and keep the bog from draining. Not sure how your plumbing works, but it may be an easy solution. At the time I thought it was a dumb idea - after all, the pipe was running DOWN... how would the water run UP and back down the line? Shows how little I understood about water.

We don't shut our pump off intentionally over winter but if we ever have to, we can keep the water from backflowing from the bog into the rain exchange. The bog will stay full to the top when the valve is closed.

 

[addy1]

Here what was sent: to help you out @combatwombat

canna, pickerel weed, bog bean, water butter cup, mint, obedient plant. lizard tail, marsh bentomy, water willow, iris, sweet flag , some deer chewed lilies.

 

[combatwombat]

@Lisak1: It's a fine idea. I even have one just as you describe so that I can control flow between the bottom of the bog and what gets dumped out on top via the overflow and fountain. My mistake is that I didn't glue any of the joints in the bog because I thought "who cares if it leaks" and it would make it easier to reconfigure if I needed to change something in the future. So even with all valves closed, water above the pipes will seep into it through those joints until it's drained down below it.

I guess I'll get to reap the rewards of my "easy to reconfigure" logic.

Thanks @addy1. I have it all written down and thought I had it all remembered. Then I started filming and forgot everything.

 

[Lisak1]

"who cares if it leaks"

Best laid plans... well, plan B. Keep it running all winter. Our first year mistake was to shut our pond down - our water drops so low in both bog and pond the we lost every single plant that first winter. We learned they don't mind being completely frozen in the ice, but marginals don't like being out of water all winter. Now that my plants are ginormous I don't think it would be as devastating for them but those first year marginals took a bad hit.

 

[GBBUDD]

@combatwombat - we put a ball valve just ahead of where the main line drops down into the bog. We can shut that and keep the bog from draining. Not sure how your plumbing works, but it may be an easy solution. At the time I thought it was a dumb idea - after all, the pipe was running DOWN... how would the water run UP and back down the line? Shows how little I understood about water.

We don't shut our pump off intentionally over winter but if we ever have to, we can keep the water from backflowing from the bog into the rain exchange. The bog will stay full to the top when the valve is closed.

But what happens when your power goes out what then ? the water will back flow and drain the bog

 

[GBBUDD]

Another little update. Thanks, @addy1 for the purge plants. The bog is as full as it's going to get for now. Probably going to have to redo some bog plumbing next year as I cannot shut down the pump for the winter without losing a foot of water in the bog. Whoops. Maybe I'll just keep it running year round and forget about it. Will see how ambitious I feel in the Spring.

Simple solution on your dog supply line being a foot under water. TAP into the line outside the bog reduce the line I assume its a 3 inch line . RUN A VENT PIPE SORTA SPEAK SO IT COMES UP above the water line. install either the vacuum breaker or do the pin hole or as poconoe did . make another small water feature like a frog spitting water etc

 

[combatwombat]

Simple solution on your dog supply line being a foot under water. TAP into the line outside the bog reduce the line I assume its a 3 inch line . RUN A VENT PIPE SORTA SPEAK SO IT COMES UP above the water line. install either the vacuum breaker or do the pin hole or as poconoe did . make another small water feature like a frog spitting water etc

I actually already have 3 of those in the bog area (dedicated vacuum breaker, fountain, and 2” overflow port) and they do not solve the problem.

How would moving the vacuum breaker outside the bog solve the problem when the problem is not siphon but the infiltration of water into the pipe via water pressure?

 

[GBBUDD]

a vacuum breaker should be as close to the highest point as possible . I don't understand how three wont break siphon

 

[combatwombat]

a vacuum breaker should be as close to the highest point as possible . I don't understand how three wont break siphon

Because the problem isn’t siphon.

 

[combatwombat]

3" of rain here in the last 72 hours. Reservoir is full again! Nothing like the storms I'm hearing about elsewhere, but sure glad I had new gutters installed this summer and cleaned out our dry wells.

My bog plumbing design continues to cause me problems. Had a power failure at some point last night. I think the reservoir overflowed and—despite my design to avoid it—some water made it into the pump house and got the extension cord connection wet. That tripped the GFCI breaker. Check valve failed, so a foot of water from the bog drained back down into the reservoir, overflowing it further.

When I opened it up, I found that the o-ring gasket in the flapper had slipped out of it's groove. The last time I had a power failure, the test plug on my DIY priming pot got blown off and same failure occurred. "Fixed" it by simply removing it. Figured I didn't need it since there would always be a foot of head from the bog to prime the line. Not if the check valve fails and the bog is empty, though!

So, I'm putting the priming pot back, but this time with a threaded plug + teflon tape. And gotta hop on it fast before all of @addy1's bog plants die.

This is a temporary solution. I can see now that I will not be able to truly rest easy until I fix the plumbing where it enters the bog. I think my solution is going to be to go back to the traditional design—plumbing goes over the liner. Not too complicated of a fix, but will have to move a bunch of rocks that were a pain to set and patch the hole I made for the bulkhead fitting.

Aye aye aye.

 

[YShahar]

Oy! What about installing a simple siphon break pipe (with a hole open to air) somewhere in the line? Wouldn't that be more reliable than the check valve? Not familiar with your plumbing setup, so this may not be applicable...

 

[addy1]

Darn,

How about cutting the pipe going through the bulkhead and cap the outside and inside pipe. Rather than try and do a patch. Not leaking now, cap the pipe, still not leaking.

 

[combatwombat]

Oy! What about installing a simple siphon break pipe (with a hole open to air) somewhere in the line? Wouldn't that be more reliable than the check valve? Not familiar with your plumbing setup, so this may not be applicable...

Afraid it won’t work. Siphon break needs to be able to introduce air into the main line, which can’t happen until water level is below the top of that mainline pipe.

I actually have 3 siphon breakers in the bog plumbing. They work! But not until water level has dropped a foot.

 

[combatwombat]

Darn,

How about cutting the pipe going through the bulkhead and cap the outside and inside pipe. Rather than try and do a patch. Not leaking now, cap the pipe, still not leaking.

That’s also an option. Thinking the bulkhead will eventually leak someday we’ll into the future so might be better to patch now while I have everything opened up.

Another option is to leave plumbing in place and puta second check valve just inside the bog liner where the pipe enters.

That would provide some additional safety, but would also require getting at the bulkhead so if I’m ripping that area up, why not do the bulletproof solution?

 

[YShahar]

Afraid it won’t work. Siphon break needs to be able to introduce air into the main line, which can’t happen until water level is below the top of that mainline pipe.

I actually have 3 siphon breakers in the bog plumbing. They work! But not until water level has dropped a foot.

Bummer.

Well hopefully you'll figure out a solution; I'm betting on your ingenuity winning the day!