Correct Way to do Pond Edging

[capewind]

That's hubby's work, not mine. I am still learning. There are lots of options of how to do things, that's why I said to look at youtube in addition to the input here, so you could figure out what would work best for your situation.

He will be doing 2 more ponds in the next few weeks ... the one here will be super slow going, as we are still short rocks for the main pond, but the other will be for a client. I'll try to take good pictures. That pond wont be fancy by any means, for lack of better wording it's a budget pond for a very good client, but it will be along the lines of what a homeowner could do. Just these clients are well into their senior years. It's removing a crappy pond someone else did for them, and giving them what they wanted in the first place.

 

[DrCase]

There is no one way to do the edge , I'm still trying to finishing a pond i built this spring ,the same pond has 2 different edges both hide the liner

 

[HTH]

The FIRST thing I said was
"First know there are several ways to do this."

Some difference of opinion here. NOT saying he is wrong, but this will depend on the compacting ability of your soil, drainage/leaching ability, as well as how steep you want your sides. In our situation, we didnt need block.

 

[Waterbug]

Excuse me WB, but I have to ask a really stupid question here. I understand/accept that there are a lot of ways to do something, but this statement makes absolutely no sense to me. Blocks would make a more solid top, but to say using blocks will make it easy to make it perfectly level isnt true, or I cant see HOW it would be true. Block or no block, the dirt would need to be LEVEL ... if the dirt wasnt compact and level before laying the blocks, the blocks will settle in time...

I'm not really following your issue, but I can tell you that "using blocks will make it easy to make it perfectly level" wasn't meant to mean for all cases, for all people or that there is no other way to make a pond level. It's an opinion, like every post. So yes, it is indeed easy to make a perfectly level edge using block.

Block or no block, the dirt would need to be LEVEL ... if the dirt wasnt compact and level before laying the blocks, the blocks will settle in time...

Yes, of course. To me if a person digs out a lot of dirt they don't have to, well, that's not easy. Dig the entire pond out just to the depth of one course of block. Undisturbed, exactly the same way a footer has to be dug. Lay the block all the way around on bare, undisturbed soil. Now you some bed material. I use decomposed granite (sometimes called minus granite, rock dust, etc.) but sharp sand can be use, dry mortar mix. Some portland can be mixed with the decomposed granite, sand, to create a weak mortar, which is how we lay patio flagstone here (thick type, not veneer). Use a water level to find the highest block.

Pour a little of the bed material into the block and lift it a little so the material gets under the block, hit the block with a rubber mallet to set. Level that block with a torpedo level (or any level). I like the torpedo because of the window in the top is easier to see the bubble.

Set the water level to that block and repeat for all other blocks.

With just a bit of attention to detail you get a perfectly level collar. I can set an entire collar in less than an hour for even a good size pond once the base has been dug. The dirt doesn't have to be perfectly flat, the bed material makes the smooth flat base. Just don't use play sand or beach sand.

You can also just use loose dirt as long as the bed isn't too thick. A bed of loose soil 1" thick and with the block set with a rubber mallet isn't going to settle enough to matter. We'd be talking 1/16" of an inch max.

I've never had a problem with a single course. Can be stood on without moving. But, sandy soil or a builder just wants less risk multiple courses can be done including all the way below the freeze line if that is a concern. Same exact method for the first course. once that's set and level the additional courses can just be dry laid with the top course bond beam. All voids can be filled and tamped with soil, or the bed material, or concrete, depending how far a person wants to go.

also, I am curious of the liner going over the block in this manner, if it is possible for water to wick into the inside of the block??? It isnt my intent to say you are wrong, I am just not understanding your statements.

In the picture water wouldn't wick. Not sure what you're seeing. Maybe you can draw something? Depending on if and how the liner is later covered could cause wicking, but that doesn't have anything to do with collar method and would be true for any method.

Our liner isnt exposed at the water level. Specifically, that's why hubby puts a shelf for the first course of rocks. The first course of rock is a minimum of 4" below surface level, so there is NO exposed liner above water level. The liner goes up behind at least two courses of rocks, and then is folded over/hidden between the rocks. I wish I had the knowledge to draw on a program as you do. Will DRAW on paper and snap a picture of what I am talking about .... Im not much of an artist... The "R" in the little boxes represent ROCKS .. Height of rocks above water line is determined by rock choice ... basketballs will give a taller wall to surrounding grade than something thin like flagstones ...

That is a standard pond construction method and is used a lot. It works fine, it's fast and results look good.

However, all of the concerns you posted about the block would be just as true when using rock. In both cases you need undisturbed soil and you need a bedding material to level the rocks unless of course you're not too concerned with a level result...but that's true when using block too. Block doesn't have to be made level. I do make it level because I like the look of a full pond. Laying rock is way more time consuming to get the same result as block.

I don't like the rock edge method because it isn't as stable and it's harder to get a level edge for maximum water level.

There are block collar options. This shows a place for water plants.

Another type of plant area.

Rock veneer to cover liner.

Another rock veneer cover. Also shows multiple courses if desired.

 

[capewind]

The FIRST thing I said was
"First know there are several ways to do this."

You did say that, as have I ... what I was trying to get across is it will depend on his situation and what he wants

 

[capewind]

Thank you WB, your explanation made perfect sense.

The wicking issue, I was thinking about your drawings of when over lapping liners at a waterfall ... gap verses no gap ... and applying it to the liner being tucked into a block ... I really like this method, as it's what I think needs to be done where our future patio will meet the bigger pond in the future ... I want more like a swimming pool edging at the patio, verses the rocks everywhere else...

 

[sissy]

I used composite wood because of termites got into some of the pressure treated wood .I guess the new pressure treated is not as good .Also level and level again if one is off the tinest bit you will see it .I use 2 levels
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[HTH]

Thank you WB, your explanation made perfect sense.

The wicking issue, I was thinking about your drawings of when over lapping liners at a waterfall ... gap verses no gap ... and applying it to the liner being tucked into a block ... I really like this method, as it's what I think needs to be done where our future patio will meet the bigger pond in the future ... I want more like a swimming pool edging at the patio, verses the rocks everywhere else...

This was my first attempt at a formal pond. It used a 2 step method where the brick sat in the water and the paver was above it. The liner ran under the brick and paver.

The support structure for the pavers was a two step platform system made from redwood fence boards. The bench was enough to give me a crisp edge but because it was not supported below the frost line it moved a bit. It was hard to keep alignment.

|.......Paver...........|
----soil-------|brick |~~~~~~~~~~water~~~~~~
----soil--------------|

Next time I am going to try casting the pond walls in earth crete (a mixture of dirt and cement) and set the pavers on top of the wall. The bricks that rest in the water need to be waterproof or the crumble when the freeze.

 

[falconut]

Here's something I was thinking. I wonder if I could use the larger pea gravel like shown below. If I slope the ledge away from the pond and taper the gravel, do you think I'd have any issues?

 

[sissy]

when you walk around pond when ground is wet they may fall in or in heavy rains they could get washed in .If you have small children they will be tossing them in .

 

[falconut]

OK, this is better. I'll just need to find the rock at the stores, hopefully the stuff I like isn't too expensive.

 

[Waterbug]

Here's something I was thinking. I wonder if I could use the larger pea gravel like shown below. If I slope the ledge away from the pond and taper the gravel, do you think I'd have any issues?

The main issue would be the obvious one which I'm sure you already know and accept, the gravel holding waste. I personally don't think it's an issue in a Water Garden but many people do.

There is a possible wicking issue. This isn't the end of the world. In most cases the water loss is so slight most people won't even notice.

The less obvious issue is sloping back the shelf. It has no effect on making the gravel more stable. Complex explanation: The term in physics is "center of mass", center of gravity is another term. By sloping back the shelf I think you may be thinking you're shifting the center of mass? But unless the pea gravel is glued together in some way the center of mass has not actually been shifted. Without bonding the pebbles together each pebble would have it's own center of mass. So how stable the pebbles are is strictly about how steep the exposed (outside) edge is.

Sloping the vertical wall would allow for a less steep pile of gravel and therefore be more stable. But of course in any case a person, pet, or raccoon stepping into that gravel is going to cause the gravel to fall away and into the pond.

The sharp soil edge is prone to erosion, rounding over with time, or even collapse. This can vary from no issue to the worst case I ever saw where the soil had rounded over about 12" back from the start.

It always comes down to the same thing...personal choice. If you're OK with the downsides/risks there's nothing at all wrong with building this way.

For myself I've come to embrace stable. I dislike having to keep adjusting rocks. Yeah, it's not that difficult, but I'm lazy and out of place rocks, rocks fallen into the pond, etc, can seem to just sit for awhile and the pond gets more and more messy.

 

[Waterbug]

The sloped back shelf does shift the center of mass for a solid rock. Stability of the soil would remain an issue.

 

[Waterbug]

The wicking issue, I was thinking about your drawings of when over lapping liners at a waterfall ... gap verses no gap ... and applying it to the liner being tucked into a block ... I really like this method, as it's what I think needs to be done where our future patio will meet the bigger pond in the future ... I want more like a swimming pool edging at the patio, verses the rocks everywhere else...

There is no overlapping liner so no wicking.

One of the things I like about having just a 2" rim and being able to fill the pond to the top is I can use this method for many kinds of ponds. If the person wants a flagstone patio right to the water's edge, no problem. Stone necklace, no problem. Plants, including turf, right to the water's edge, no problem. Combination of these, no problem. Future edge changes, no problem.

And while a shelf can be made for stacking rocks like with any other method, the block collar also allows for fake rock to be hung on the edge to hide the inside liner.

 

[DrCase]

I a still making stone caps to go over bricks on one side of my pond.
The other side is rock