Combining 2 pumps

[ginger_biscuit69]

hey, sorry for long reply time, thought id go fullon:

id keep the 15000 as the central main filtration pump, with the return coming out at 90degrees mid depth as pictured.

add a skimmer where pictured with its own 'filter', its just for catching solids so providing it has the basket with some japmat under should do the job. Id put the outlet of this opposite the filter outlet also at 90degrees to promote the circulation of the water volume.

For aeration, id suggest purchasing a diaphram pump of around 75-100l/hr such as an EA airtech75, purchasing a large air diffuser like this : http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/12-AIR-DIFFUS...=400210066817&ps=63&clkid=9108009953324574434 , ziptie the diffuser on top of the large central pump, and connect it up with around 15mm airline (would require some inventive plumbing!). This would give you the benefits of an aerated bottom drain - the central uplift pulls debris in the water towards the base of the air diffuser:

Dont use the 25kl water pump, they are designed for occasional use, not constant use. The filter/skimmer combo should be adequate to run the pond, with a third small pump going into the reed bed (only needs to be around 2000l/hr).

Filtration sounds good, if ammonia and nitrite are stable at 0, its perfect. Job done.

Hope this is of help, you are a lucky man having that. Addition of a 55w UVC to the main filter maybe needed sometime when the water clears if it starts to algae up!

 

[DrCase]

Im not sure I understand what you are saying, but the more I think about it, the more it seems like a bad idea, regardless of the diameter of the hose (which is wide enough). Ill just get another hose and make something at the filter so I can connect it without the second pump having to fight with the pressure of the first.

Im saying my laguna 4500 gph has a 1 1/2" Max outlet
if i ran a 1" hose i would not get all the flow out of my pump
The 1 1/2" hose gives me less resistance and the pump can move the water as it was designed for
Two lines would be best

 

[vertigo72]

Wow, ginger_biscuit. Wanna come over and do some digging too lol?

Big thanks for the thoughts and the work you put in!

However I should have mentioned I have no intention of drilling through or breaking the concrete. Thats why a wall skimmer is not an option, and hanging something on the edge isnt easy with all the slopes and curves. Especially not where you drew it, as there is a large Japanese cherry tree ~1 meter from where you drew the skimmer. I expect roots .

I might build something that attaches to the underwater wall on the right lob of the pond though, at least that gives me a straight wall that goes straight down.

Another thought I had last night, is to use water rotation. Before I anchored my air line with stones, it was floating, and I noticed it performed admirably as "skimmer" when I was rotating the entire pond with the 8K pump, or just when the wind blew hard enough. Debris collected nicely against the airline, and then "slid" towards the pond egde, and I could skoop it up easily. Perhaps I should make something working on the same principle, but with a net/basket to capture it. Either that, or I should buy one or two of those floating skimmers with integrated pump. ANything is better than nothing. Not sure yet what Ill do though.

id keep the 15000 as the central main filtration pump, with the return coming out at 90degrees mid depth as pictured.

TBH Im not sure thats a good idea. Already the outflow from the filter seems to go to the pump too quickly. I noticed that when I added some GH+ in the filter. The white clouds in the outflow sank pretty damn fast, almost straight towards the pump. Now the GH stuff is probably heavier than water, but it was stunning nonetheless, and putting the output at half depth would make that worse even. Not too mention a 110mm pipe is not pretty in water.. Im thinking of moving the outflow to the right lob of of the pond instead. That way the filtered water will have to travel over that submerged wall, in to the main pond. Would also help a tiny bit keeping the water rotating.

For aeration, id suggest purchasing a diaphram pump of around 75-100l/hr such as an EA airtech75, purchasing a large air diffuser like this :

I already have a 160L/hour pump (piston I think? made for 24/7 operation with no maintenance) and a similar sized air disc, which indeed, is on top of the pump . Thanks for that picture though, now I understand why I had to put it there!. I also have several air stones in the bio filter barrels, and if I do that lava rock bed in the right lob, I will aerate that too to prevent pockets of standing water.

Dont use the 25kl water pump, they are designed for occasional use, not constant use.

True, but I said Id only turn it on occasionally, for 15 minutes at a time, a few times per day. Once the water spins, it keeps spinning for like an hour, if not more. Besides, its already survived ~12h/7 operation for a year prior to my work, when it was used as fountain pump and to keep the pond from freezing over in winter (and to accidentally empty the pond lol). Maybe it wont last, in fact, probably it wont, its already making more noise than in the beginning I think, but it was cheap (Aldi supermarket) and has lasted far longer than one would expect. I could easily pick up another one at Aldi if it lasts 3 years. Thing is, this pump does turn the pond in a vortex that removes debris from the bottom, the 8K pump isnt powerful enough to do that.

Addition of a 55w UVC to the main filter maybe needed sometime when the water clears if it starts to algae up!

hadnt mentioned this either yet, but I picked up a 36W UVC a few weeks ago. I know 36W isnt enough, but I thought it wouldnt hurt either. I wasnt planning on using UVC at all, but the guy that sold me the 15K pump asked me if I wanted it, and I said no, but did a silly bid of 20 euro, and he agreed. Its 6 months old and only been used a few weeks . Anyway, I put it inline with the pump going to the iris bed as thats my weakest pump. Hoping it will help a bit killing parasites if nothing else.

 

[vertigo72]

oops,edit. my airpump actually puts out 160L per *minute*. Its this one. I suspect thats also what you meant though.

 

[vertigo72]

update: your idea for changing the outflow works brilliantly. I misinterpreted your picture thinking your aim was just to get the flow below water, while you wanted to change the flow direction clockwise.. and of course, that doesnt work well if the outflow is above water, as the water just drops down. I added a few elbows and short piece of pipe, and the water is turning in the entire pond now, gently scraping the bottom clean and pushing all floating debris to a few places where I can put a net/basket or skimmer. Brilliant. Thanks!

 

[ginger_biscuit69]

no problem! is something i saw done on a chaps pond i visited, and saw how combined with the airlift, kept the thing so damn clean.

I like the sound of the pond sealing product P1 (http://www.koicarp.net/pond_construction/paints_stains/p-1.html), would provide a nice smooth plastic like surface which will help stop algae forming, and further slicken the waste removal process (you were asking about painting the pond a while ago i remember) green looks good.

Combined with the filtering UVC and flow, the pond will be spotless in no time.

Need to get in a habit of taking more pictures... start a single thread showing the evolution from start to present, instead of spreading it all over the place!

 

[vertigo72]

no problem! is something i saw done on a chaps pond i visited, and saw how combined with the airlift, kept the thing so damn clean.

I like the sound of the pond sealing product P1 (http://www.koicarp.net/pond_construction/paints_stains/p-1.html), would provide a nice smooth plastic like surface which will help stop algae forming, and further slicken the waste removal process (you were asking about painting the pond a while ago i remember) green looks good.

Mine is getting green without any paint
It does look like a nice product, but my pond is full again. Ill revisit the idea next time I drain it completely, no sooner than in a year or ... 5 or 10 I hope Maybe sooner if I install a water well, the tap water bill is going to kill me I think.

Combined with the filtering UVC and flow, the pond will be spotless in no time.

Nah, Im not that ambitious. The placement and design of the pond makes spotless pretty much impossible I think. Ill settle for healthy water, and being able to see the bottom and my fish. The water is already turning tea color and the bottom is anything but spotless. But thats okay. I never aspired a large aquarium.

Need to get in a habit of taking more pictures... start a single thread showing the evolution from start to present, instead of spreading it all over the place!

Yeah, I should. In my defense this thread was about combining two pumps to one filter, you are the one that started suggesting I redo everything else .

 

[ginger_biscuit69]

ahahaha, always blaming the ginger....

i was merely suggesting how to best utilise things, a pond like that shouldnt need a gallion litres/hour being pumped here there and everywhere!!

Seem to be making progress at least. Just bear in mind everything takes time, its hard to resist the urge to go out and tinker on a daily basis. Im lucky that the pond im accountable for i only get to a week or two per few months, appart from summer when im back weekly, things get left alone to simply get on with it!

 

[vertigo72]

I dont pump a gazillion liters. Most people here seem to think you need a turn around time of an hour or even less. I dont think that applies to large ponds as mine, especially not with low stocking, but even with both pumps running, I estimate Im getting "only" about ~10K liter actual flow through my filter and a few more through my iris bed. Thats a turn around time of 3-4 hours. Probably sufficient, but hardly exaggerated.

Anyway, Id rather overdo it this time. That pic you photoshopped earlier in this thread, everything you see there is not water, its not dirty water, its thick mud and crud or whatever you want to call it. Knee deep. Something had to change

 

[Malak]

Hey, maybe Ginger would like to stop by and do all the work for you. lol

 

[ginger_biscuit69]

assume you have shovelled it all out since? is sadly what happens with neglect (not from you), reads are good for munching away the nitrates stopping green water, and the ponds natural biological content will cope with low loads (like in nature) hence its been fine. I can imagine with your filtering etc running, the pond will support a much higher stocking level now and you could grow some monsters if you wanted.