Anoxic filters?

[crsublette]

Ah the eric filter yes its world famous , I do from time to time go over to themthrerekoyas just for an update but prefare Manke Sanke's site , Syd and I go back many years water is Syd's area of expetice and he rates the anoxic system .
I think Kevin saw his system as a threat to the commercial filter which when you think about it , it is.......
Which might explain him not wanting to publish his results , who nows ?

Dave

His system is no more of a threat to the "commercial filter industry" than the ERIC filter and the other DIY'd wet/dry filters that are actually commercially sold.

The Anoxic system simply clarifies a system in the proper usage of laterite clay and other clay products in the pond context. Also, laterite is the main required component in the anoxic baskets.

Laterite clay has been around for a long time and its benefits are quite known in the aquarium industry and especially quite well known in the denitrification arena. Laterite was created for this exact purpose, that is to be a material to electrochemically pull cationic compounds like ammonium and is quite rich in trace minerals and allows excellent microorganism adhesion, so plants and microorganisms can thrive quite well and have quick access to the proper compounds. Laterite is known to actually bind ammonium to the medium, that is then available to plant roots and microorganisms, so to also help reduce ammonia test results; again, this is part of the reason why laterite was created in the aquarium industry. The difference between Laterite clay and other cooked clay products, such as kitty litter, is the number of impurities that diminishes the negative charge of the clay. Laterite clay is known to have the fewest of the impurities so that the clay's negative charge is diminished very little by other positively charged minerals. This is explained quite well and into detail, along with citations, in the article on the The Krib, titled Everything You Want To Know About Laterite.

However, professor Novak attempts to disregard laterite's well documented ionic impact on compounds by stating, "has no bearing or reinforcement of the cores magnetism or for that matter the clays crystalline structural electrical charge of diffusion whatsoever." (Novak, 14 January 2014, thank you for devoting so many years of passion, time and effort in bringing light to anoxic filtration). Also, in this exchange, he also attempts to take the ERIC to task in comparing the Anoxic system to the ERIC, which I imagine the folk at ThemThereKoyas have a few words to say.

Here is an exact quote made by Dr. Novak, from an article in his blog website, "The Anoxic Filters BCB’ has a higher good bacteria count than what is expected, but the utilization of the special facultative bacteria in question could be better optimally if the filter was reengineered to do so. However, to do this would compromise the systems inexpensiveness to the hobbyist and then other conventional filters would become the better choice." Wha what... I thought the anoxic filtration was the "holy grail" of filtration...

But... I guess I am just sharing this information because I am part of "too many hobbyists that would rather not let you know about the AFS because of ignorance and prejudice opinions" (Novak, 19 February 2014, if you think its easy to get the word out)

I would actually place a thin layer of calcium carbonate flakes on top of the baskets so to help out the aerobic microorganisms that reside on the top layer.


I think professor Novak is over playing his hand.

Once he can cite studies that show the efficacy of it in the aquaculture industry, as has been done with polygeyser bead filters and other filtration technologies, then Novak will have the proper authority to claim he has made the "holy grail of filtration".


Novak is simply taking what is already scientifically known, repackaging it into a nice inexpensive system, and then reselling it as the "holy grail of filtration [for hobbyists]".

The Anoxic system simply clarifies a system in the proper usage of laterite clay and other clay products in the hobbyist pond context, which this has been known and practiced for years in the aquarium industry.


I think, if folk are willing to sacrifice the area footprint for the filter install, then I say do it if interested to do it, that is unless I am deemed too ignorant and prejudice to make such of a recommendation.

 

[crsublette]

It has been a while since I have queried professor Novak since KKU dissappeared, but it appears Novak did the same for his Anoxic system that Waddington has done for his ERIC system. They have created them self a website, that is entirely dedicated for them to share their system unopposed and moderated entirely by them self, which is quite fine. Hopefully, this will be a nice safe place for Novak so he can feel comfortable in sharing much more information.

Here is the new home of the Anoxic Filtraiton System.

 

[JohnHuff]

Thanks for the link. Part of the problem why those guys didn't treat Novak seriously is because of posts like this:

http://anoxicfiltrationsystem.blogs...-its-easy-getting-word-out.html?view=flipcard

It reads like a snake oil salesman's pitch. High on anecdotes, low on substance. I won't quote it but the entire post is fluff. It's the same sort of evidence that someone would give for a Skippy. Actually, just substitute Skippy in place of AFS and it would read the same. SMH.

 

[crsublette]

Oh, this is too rich... The drama continues...

And here is Mr. Novak chastising and addressing me directly... then also along with any other "doubters"... Obviously, Mr. Novak has paid a service to make sure nobody says anything bad about the AFS (anoxic filtration system) without him knowing it. Uh oh !!! Now we get to the truth of the matter as to why Mr. Novak created that blog, that is to tell the doubters how wrong they are and to tear down folk that factually disagree with him.

Apparently, Mr. Novak found what the "doubters" have to say to be quite impressionable. Hmm... Why?

It's been a while since I have queried professor Novak since KKU disappeared...

Also, Mr. Waddington is only selling his system commercially since there is an actual demand for it and he is simply filling that demand. Mr. Waddington initially never sold his system commercially and the ERIC began entirely as a "DIY at home project" and these projects can be easily found on the YouTube from many years ago before Mr. Waddington started to sell it commercially. Aaahh, but now, in Mr. Novak's eyes, I guess Mr. Waddington is one of those "evil commercial filter" guys that are just too "ignorant and prejudice" to "get it".

Real question here is... Why has the commercial aquaculture farms not taken this filtration system seriously? Oh, I bet they're just too "ignorant and prejudice" to "get it". Better yet, lets use Mr. Novak's own words, from an article in his blog website, "The Anoxic Filters BCB’ has a higher good bacteria count than what is expected, but the utilization of the special facultative bacteria in question could be better optimally if the filter was reengineered to do so. However, to do this would compromise the systems inexpensiveness to the hobbyist and then other conventional filters would become the better choice." Wha what... I thought the anoxic filtration was the "holy grail" of filtration...

Furthermore, I can go on and on as to why and show examples of waste treatment centers and aquaculture businesses primarily utilizing wet/dry filters for their biological filtration.. Hmmm. I wonder why...

Hey Mr. Novak, since you're watching me, try "googling" the conversion rate performance results of polygeyser bead filters in the commercial aquaculture industry. You will be amazed by how much information manufacturers allow the Universities to share. Actually, this is one type of feedback performed by Universities on how manufacturers improve their product and serves as good marketing for them. Wise up sir!!

Also, Mr. Novak, the context of terms determine its definition, and, in the context of this freshwater pond hobby, the term "bog" is defined as a Veggie filter with an upflow particulate filter. The only two differences between the AFS and a bog, in our context, is the compartmentalization of the medium, and the use of settlement chamber sedimentation for particulate filtration instead of an integrated upflow particulate filter. Both filtration designs still perform a noticeable reduction of nitrates, whether it is by plants (primarily in bogs) or by the AFS (primarily in denitrification and much of the time AFS is seen with plants and microscopic algae in the AFS reservoir).

 

[crsublette]

I think, if folk are willing to sacrifice the area footprint for the filter install, then I say do it if interested to do it, that is unless I am deemed too ignorant and prejudice to make such of a recommendation.

The above quote deserves to be repeated...

It is quite astounding how Mr. Novak deems area footprint cost as quite irrelevant.

Also, it is quite astounding how little informed hobbyists are involving the beneficial impact of clay products in the pond !!

Watergardening hobbyists forever have been setting up "mini AFS's", that is pots with kitty litter and potentially other beneficial ammendments, even before Mr. Novak came along. Now, they have a good explanation as to why their ponds have worked out so well.

Again... The Anoxic system simply clarifies a system in the proper usage of laterite clay and other clay products in the pond context. Novak is simply taking what is already scientifically known, repackaging it into a nice inexpensive system, and then reselling it as the "holy grail of filtration [for hobbyists]"...

...all of this is quite fine except lets try to be honest about it without using the "snake oil" salesman pitches and without making exaggerated claims, which they are, of ineffectiveness involving the "terrible conventional" filters...

 

[JohnHuff]

And here is Mr. Novak chastising and addressing me directly... then also along with any other "doubters"... Obviously, Mr. Novak has paid a service to make sure nobody says anything bad about the AFS (anoxic filtration system) without him knowing it.

Scary.
Let me tell you my personal experience. I run a forum that features certain products. Sometimes people say derogatory things about them. It's painful to read, that's for sure. Some of the people are trolls and I'll ban them no problem.

However, some of the critical posts are very helpful once you get past the hurt feelings. I also have to admit, you cannot run a forum that only has fawning fans who worship at the altar. The only way to improve and grow is to invite contrary and critical examination of your products. Your doubters are also your free testers and quality control.

Crsublette, my hat is off to you.

 

[JohnHuff]

I did some reading on laterite and its use in waste water treatment, specifically the removal of P from sewage wastes. I think that's the wrong way to do it. I think a better, more eco friendly way would be to use algae to remove P and nitrogenous compounds from waste water, runoffs and sewage and reuse the algae for fertilizer. Doesn't have to be fertilizer for food, could use it for trees and gardens. Of course the problem then would be logistics, but I think it could be solved.

 

[crsublette]

Scary.
Let me tell you my personal experience. I run a forum that features certain products. Sometimes people say derogatory things about them. It's painful to read, that's for sure. Some of the people are trolls and I'll ban them no problem.

However, some of the critical posts are very helpful once you get past the hurt feelings. I also have to admit, you cannot run a forum that only has fawning fans who worship at the altar. The only way to improve and grow is to invite contrary and critical examination of your products. Your doubters are also your free testers and quality control.

Crsublette, my hat is off to you.

Yep, you hit the nail on the head.

 

[crsublette]

I did some reading on laterite and its use in waste water treatment, specifically the removal of P from sewage wastes. I think that's the wrong way to do it. I think a better, more eco friendly way would be to use algae to remove P and nitrogenous compounds from waste water, runoffs and sewage and reuse the algae for fertilizer. Doesn't have to be fertilizer for food, could use it for trees and gardens. Of course the problem then would be logistics, but I think it could be solved.

There ya go... Now, I just wish more hobbyists would do as you did John, that is start thinking for them self by doing some personal homework and "light" reading.

Also, there is algae present in the AFS reservoir, due to the pictures I have seen, which is another contribution point as to why the AFS is quite effective. Yet, of course, this is only talked about "in passing".