Newbie! Looking for design advice

[Acorn74]

Hi Guys, I, like many, have been reading posts from all the experienced folks for over a year. Thanks so much for having this forum! I’m still in design phase (dream phase?) for my pond. I’m the type that designs and redesigns the crap out of everything before I even break ground. I’m looking for feedback on my current design, especially with regard to how to manage overflow. It will be a large pond. I want to have to parallel filtration systems, one running through a bog wetland filter, and the second through a suction grid and waterfall filter. The idea is that if one pump fails or needs maintenance, I still have some filtration to fall back on. The grade of the site is high at the right hand side (near driveway and entrance to barn road) and it falls off pretty quickly to fairy flat where the main pond will be. I plan on building the bog at the high side, then having steps down the slope to where the rain exchange is at the base of the bog. The streams form a descending circuit from bog to waterfall to pond to negative edge to rain exchange and then pumped back up to bog. The overflow as currently drawn runs off to the left toward the rear of the space that’s a bit downhill from the pond site. What I can’t quite wrap my head around is how do I make the overflow work for excess water in the system (here in NE we recently have had some specular downpours that may overwhelm the rain exchange), without having everything just dump over the negative edge instead? Obviously gravity… but can you practically put the overflow slightly above target water level and still have water go that way instead of flood the intake bay and rain exchange? I can’t divert water away from the rain exchange because that direction is right into our main garden/lawn and slightly uphill at that point. Location is near full sun, but surrounded by trees (other side of barn road is deciduous forest).
Ultimate plan for pond is koi and/or goldfish (loving those Shubunkins some of you have). It was -14F here for a couple days last Feb, so the deep round part of the pond will be absolutely necessary. I wish I could figure out a way to keep one of the filters running all winter, but I think it’s just too cold here and I’d get ice dams that would create a disaster.
Keys to the plan: circled numbers are depth. Numbers with arrows are distance between outer edges of pond. There’s about a 4 foot drop between bog and pond down the slope of the right hand side. Little Box over the negative edge stream is small bridge/walkway (forgot to label it).

 

[Mmathis]

Hello and welcome!

 

[GBBUDD]

I wish I could figure out a way to keep one of the filters running all winter

Hi Guys, I, like many, have been reading posts from all the experienced folks for over a year. Thanks so much for having this forum! I’m still in design phase (dream phase?) for my pond. I’m the type that designs and redesigns the crap out of everything before I even break ground. I’m looking for feedback on my current design, especially with regard to how to manage overflow. It will be a large pond. I want to have to parallel filtration systems, one running through a bog wetland filter, and the second through a suction grid and waterfall filter. The idea is that if one pump fails or needs maintenance, I still have some filtration to fall back on. The grade of the site is high at the right hand side (near driveway and entrance to barn road) and it falls off pretty quickly to fairy flat where the main pond will be. I plan on building the bog at the high side, then having steps down the slope to where the rain exchange is at the base of the bog. The streams form a descending circuit from bog to waterfall to pond to negative edge to rain exchange and then pumped back up to bog. The overflow as currently drawn runs off to the left toward the rear of the space that’s a bit downhill from the pond site. What I can’t quite wrap my head around is how do I make the overflow work for excess water in the system (here in NE we recently have had some specular downpours that may overwhelm the rain exchange), without having everything just dump over the negative edge instead? Obviously gravity… but can you practically put the overflow slightly above target water level and still have water go that way instead of flood the intake bay and rain exchange? I can’t divert water away from the rain exchange because that direction is right into our main garden/lawn and slightly uphill at that point. Location is near full sun, but surrounded by trees (other side of barn road is deciduous forest).
Ultimate plan for pond is koi and/or goldfish (loving those Shubunkins some of you have). It was -14F here for a couple days last Feb, so the deep round part of the pond will be absolutely necessary. I wish I could figure out a way to keep one of the filters running all winter, but I think it’s just too cold here and I’d get ice dams that would create a disaster.
Keys to the plan: circled numbers are depth. Numbers with arrows are distance between outer edges of pond. There’s about a 4 foot drop between bog and pond down the slope of the right hand side. Little Box over the negative edge stream is small bridge/walkway (forgot to label it).
View attachment 159631

need to place arrows in direction of flow on your drawing . you have a lot going on there, and to go with the arrows pictures help.

 

[Acorn74]

Better? I’m planning on using jets about 12-18” down to help circulate the water around the big pool and also direct water down the narrow section toward the skimmer.

 

[GBBUDD]

Your intake bay I would make more like an extension of the pond with a shallow narrow opening like 6 to 8 inches so you can close it up as needed depending on the time of year. That way the pond collects all the leaves in one area. And then st the end of t he intake a negative edge that drops to the vault where you simply place a net and the leaves again are collected for you.
Fish / koi love this area because it has current and they are river fish.

I hope you 6x8 deck is not for chairs or they better be swivels so you can spin around and get in and out 6 feet is barely wide enough for two. If tat is the intent

The rain harvesting I would make so it can contain at least 3000 gallons if not twice that for a pond and falls of this size. Unless you have a great well.

Very ambitious plan I do hope your are handy
I have a link to my blog building my pond construction notes and photos in the seco d half I think you' ll find it worth reading

 

[j.w]

@Acorn74
Wow you are going to have an amazing pond!

 

[Acorn74]

Thanks for the suggestions on the intake bay and rain exchange, GBBudd. I’ve loved reading about your pond, and I value your opinion. Yes, it’s an ambitious project, but we’re good at those. Finished a 40’ diameter pea gravel and landscape fire pit area 2 years ago, and a 2500 sf new garden last year. This is the last “corner” of the yard that needs working on. We have a tractor to help us move big rocks.

What about the excess water run off? How do I make sure that extra water doesn’t just flood the negative edge and rain exchange?

 

[GBBUDD]

If your topography drains away from. Those areas anything will do a 4 inch pipe if you get big storms. A 2 inch if small storms from. Each of those areas. Again what's the top. Can
A simple low edge alow water to drain away.

My cistern has a low edge that's actually a foot lower than the area. The cistern has 4 to 6 inches of sand around it . Yes it floods when we get heavy rains but it's gone in a few hours leaving the cistern full .

 

[Acorn74]

Not sure I’m following you GBBUDD. We do get big storms now (feels like a New England monsoon season this year), so a 2 “ pipe would get overwhelmed fairly quickly. I was thinking the overflow would be a dry creek bed leading away from the pond rather than a pipe, and I’m trying to figure out where the best place for that would be as well as how to set the level of the overflow with respect to target pond water level. Or would you suggest overflow pipe at multiple locations instead?

 

[GBBUDD]

I was thinking the overflow would be a dry creek

Absolutely, the pipe was if you had to cover a distance to get to a low area.
I don't even have a creek my soil and fill around the cistern disputes over flow. All the excess water I have goes to the cistern it is the end of the line. So it is topped off before any over flow starts to do its job.

You only need an over flow in one area if it is large enough. And like I said mine is at the cistern so it has to be full before I waste water. The water will balance out . If you saw my pond video with aquascape the cistern is 5 steps lower than is where the bog/ wetland filter starts.
Gravity does it thing and brings all water to the lowest point being the cistern.

I too am in New England for a change there's a few Yankees here , we are usually out numbered by the south. Ct here where are you .