Pond leaked out overnight

[Tincan]

Ive had a problem with my 2x1x1m bog filtered pond.
I settled the .05mil liner shape with a week of 0.2m of water standing, before filling it up via the bog filter and a Jebao pump. 2 days later it had emptied back to the 0.2m level. I can't find any tears and so i assume its the liners bond that failed and so I'm replacing it along with the underlay. Does anyone know of any other causes that might result in such a problem? It is still a learning game for me, so any comment really appreciated.

 

[Jhn]

What is the liner made out of and how did you seem them together? You have any updated pics of the setup with bog filter attached, so we can see how it is setup?

If there are no tears, it is either the liners where you seamed them together or in your bog plumbing/return to the pond.

 

[poconojoe]

I'm not sure what you are describing. Maybe it was the fault of spell correct?
Can you clarify?

 

[Tincan]

What is the liner made out of and how did you seem them together? You have any updated pics of the setup with bog filter attached, so we can see how it is setup?

If there are no tears, it is either the liners where you seamed them together or in your bog plumbing/return to the pond.

Its a Heissner PVC -5mm liner 4x4m. I bought it from Amazon pre-seamed.The pump feeds a small water butt via a hosepipe which feeds the bog and in turn the pond which feeds the pond. I've dismantled the setup awaiting the replacement underlay and liner so i can't supply a photo. The pump was operating all night and had pumped all out of the pond to the 0.2m level. The water butt had not been fed but it to dropped to 0.2m below the outlet pipe of the water butt. which is not possible. I can only guess at an animal incursion interfering with the setup, no evidence of it, hence the conclusion of liner failure. I keep thinking ive done something wrong but i can't see it, its frustrating.

 

[Tincan]

I'm not sure what you are describing. Maybe it was the fault of spell correct?
Can you clarify?

I hope my response to jhn clarifies my problem,

 

[poconojoe]

I don't know what a water butt is, but I can tell you that PVC liners are the absolute worse liners out there. They puncture easily, are quickly susceptible to the sun's UV light and become brittle in a matter of months. I know this from when I was a novice back 12 or so years ago. I made the mistake of using a PVC liner due to the low cost. I paid for it dearly in more than one way.

The liner developed a leak in the middle of the (Pennsylvania) Winter. I couldn't do a liner change in the Winter, so I had to keep adding water until Springtime. 300 gallons a week. Then Spring came and I had to rip everything out. Plants, fish, etc. I lost my favorite fish during the process. He was a large salmon colored koi. Very unique. I've never seen another one like that.

You should be using either EPDM or HDRPE liner material.

 

[Tincan]

I don't know what a water butt is, but I can tell you that PVC liners are the absolute worse liners out there. They puncture easily, are quickly susceptible to the sun's UV light and become brittle in a matter of months. I know this from when I was a novice back 12 or so years ago. I made the mistake of using a PVC liner due to the low cost. I paid for it dearly in more than one way.

The liner developed a leak in the middle of the (Pennsylvania) Winter. I couldn't do a liner change in the Winter, so I had to keep adding water until Springtime. 300 gallons a week. Then Spring came and I had to rip everything out. Plants, fish, etc. I lost my favorite fish during the process. He was a large salmon colored koi. Very unique. I've never seen another one like that.

You should be using either EPDM or HDRPE liner material.

Thanks , alas my budget couldn't stretch to EPDM. the brand of liner comes with a 10 year guarantee, and claims to be UV and cold, compatible, biologically harmless, root and tear resistant - amazon have sent a free replacement. Its my first pond so im not sure what to expect during the York winter, its normally very damp.If this repeats then i suppose i will half to go with EPDM, thanks,

 

[Lisak1]

Ugh - that's the worst. I always tell people - never skimp on the first thing that goes in your pond, because if it fails you have to take everything out again to replace it. Buy the best liner and skimp on a pump would be my advice. Those are easy to replace when they fail, and honestly even the cheap ones could surprise you and work for a good long time!

Good luck with your new liner - at least it's not costing you any money to replace it. Just good old back breaking labor! Do make sure that your liner isn't being pulled or tugged or bearing any weight when you replace it in the pond. Give it lots of slack so you aren't putting pressure on it when you fill it with water or put rocks on it. Nothing should be taut - all nicely draped in the pond. You want it to be nice and relaxed in the pond! If you put any big rocks on the liner, use some of that old liner as a protective piece between the rock and the new liner to avoid anything sharp coming in contact with it.

 

[Tincan]

Ugh - that's the worst. I always tell people - never skimp on the first thing that goes in your pond, because if it fails you have to take everything out again to replace it. Buy the best liner and skimp on a pump would be my advice. Those are easy to replace when they fail, and honestly even the cheap ones could surprise you and work for a good long time!

Good luck with your new liner - at least it's not costing you any money to replace it. Just good old back breaking labor! Do make sure that your liner isn't being pulled or tugged or bearing any weight when you replace it in the pond. Give it lots of slack so you aren't putting pressure on it when you fill it with water or put rocks on it. Nothing should be taut - all nicely draped in the pond. You want it to be nice and relaxed in the pond! If you put any big rocks on the liner, use some of that old liner as a protective piece between the rock and the new liner to avoid anything sharp coming in contact with it.

Thanks. the old liner didn't leak below .2m so no impact damage to the floor, the failure must be on the sides of the seam but no sign of this either. I followed the water route and couldn't find a source tear. Ive upgraded my underlay to .3mil now, but this produces many folds and so reduces the capacity of the pond - no other option. I hope i can find some heavy water to put it back in position!

 

[poconojoe]

Ugh - that's the worst. I always tell people - never skimp on the first thing that goes in your pond, because if it fails you have to take everything out again to replace it. Buy the best liner and skimp on a pump would be my advice. Those are easy to replace when they fail, and honestly even the cheap ones could surprise you and work for a good long time!

Good luck with your new liner - at least it's not costing you any money to replace it. Just good old back breaking labor! Do make sure that your liner isn't being pulled or tugged or bearing any weight when you replace it in the pond. Give it lots of slack so you aren't putting pressure on it when you fill it with water or put rocks on it. Nothing should be taut - all nicely draped in the pond. You want it to be nice and relaxed in the pond! If you put any big rocks on the liner, use some of that old liner as a protective piece between the rock and the new liner to avoid anything sharp coming in contact with it.

EXACTLY!!
Penny wise, dollar foolish as they say.
All the money, work, time and stress to the fish from being moved back and forth. In the long run (or actually the short run... that PVC liner will fail in a short period of time, I guarantee it) it's cheaper, less work, less stress to just save up some money and do it right the first time.

I wouldn't use a PVC liner even if it were free. And that's from experience (when I was a novice).

 

[Tincan]

I've tried again with a replacement liner and a 3mil underlay, but levels are still dropping. I'm now considering alternatives and possibly its a problem with the pump-bog filter.
I'm using a Jebao pump with a Max Flow Rate: 3500 LPH - Max Flow Rate @ 0.5m: 2600 LPH - Max. Head: 2.5m. It feeds a water butt 2.5m away via a 20mil hose pipe which in turn feeds the bog via a 40mil waste pipe and a .3m run to the pond.
I suspect the pump is draining the pond too fast for the flow return rate. Does anyone know of a fix for this? Ive mailed Jebao - no response yet.

 

[Jhn]

If the pump is draining the pond faster than gravity can feed the water back into it then you should see it overflowing somewhere. One idea is The waste pipe may not be able to handle the flow you are pushing through it and letting the excess water overflow.

Pics of your setup would really help us troubleshoot this for you.

 

[Mmathis]

Agree, please post some pictures!

 

[poconojoe]

You should be able to see where all that water is coming out.
If the pump is too powerful and the water is not returning quick enough by gravity, add a wye to split the output of the pump. Send one part of the wye through your current plumbing and send the other side of the wye directly into the pond. Add a ball valve to each so you can regulate each one separately.

 

[Laaf]

Let the water drain to as low as it will go. The leak would be just above the water line somewhere if it is in the seam or liner itself.

Try keeping the pump off overnight to see if the leak might be in the plumbing not the pond itself.

If the pond and bog hold their level with the pump off, it is either a leak at the connection between the bog and pond or in the plumbing. The bog can be trickier since the water could naturally go back to the pond via the plumbing with no one way valve on the tubing.

It sounds like you lost a lot of water. There should be wetness somewhere you are not expecting it.

I am sorry for the stress. If you have already disassembled........hopefully it will work leak free the first time you run the new setup!