Pond Expansion

[sterobbo99]

Hi

I've spent the last 2 weeks reading as much as I can as I am planning an expansion to my pond. I currently have a 450l small pond which is around 35cm deep. In the last few days the liner has begun to leak so I am going to take the opportunity to do some expansions! I plan to make the pond around 4m x 2m x .75m deep. I will be doing all the work myself with a hand from my Dad. I've calculated the pond volume to be around 7000l. Would a 5300l/ph pump be enough or shall I go bigger? I've read guidance to say go for twice as much as my pond volume but is this necessary?

I have around 30 - 40 small/medium goldfish and shubunkin currently in my pond. Whilst I carry out the works I am planning on temporarily housing my current fish in a large paddling pool and use the existing all in one pump that I currently have for filtration/aeration. I was planning on pumping the current pond water into the paddling pool and then transferring the fish once the paddling pool level is enough. The dimensions of the paddling pool are roughly the same as the pond. Does this sound ok? Also, what are the steps I need to take to reintroduce the fish into the new pond once I'm complete? I understand I need to ensure the water is safe and have a testing kit and dechlorinator but is there anything else I can do to make sure I don't stress my fish?

The place the pond is has a slight incline and I have been reading into how to get the pond level so the water level sits right. To do this do i need to build up from the bottom of the pond or can I just level off where the top of the liner will sit and not worry about the excavated part being deeper at the bottom?

I was planning on getting a Flexiliner pond liner and underlay from pondkeeper.co.uk but I can't see anything to say what the liner is made of so I'm a bit worried about the quality. Should I stretch to an EPDM liner or has anyone had any experience of the Flexiliner? When it comes to fitting the liner, is it a case of layering up the underlay and then positioning and folding the liner until its nice and flat?

Lastly (I think!), electrics. I have my current pump plugged into an outside socket. I will need 4 sockets for the pump/UV/outdoor lights etc. My plan is to buy and outdoor extension and plug that into the outside socket and then run my cables underground and into the extension. Does anyone know if this is ok in regards to electrical rules? I would much prefer to have a dedicated switch box for my pond stuff and then keep the sockets seperate for outdoor lights but I'm not sure how I can get a 2nd electrical supply outside? I'm happy to pay for an electrician to do this if necessary. Another complication is that the nearest interior wall where a supply could be ran from is all tiled so not an easy job to fish cables etc!

If anyone can give me some pointers or things to look out for it would be much appreciated! I've read a lot of threads and haven't found the answers to my specifics but if I've repeated any regular questions then I apologise.

Thanks

 

[brokensword]

Hi

I've spent the last 2 weeks reading as much as I can as I am planning an expansion to my pond. I currently have a 450l small pond which is around 35cm deep. In the last few days the liner has begun to leak so I am going to take the opportunity to do some expansions! I plan to make the pond around 4m x 2m x .75m deep. I will be doing all the work myself with a hand from my Dad. I've calculated the pond volume to be around 7000l. Would a 5300l/ph pump be enough or shall I go bigger? I've read guidance to say go for twice as much as my pond volume but is this necessary?

I have around 30 - 40 small/medium goldfish and shubunkin currently in my pond. Whilst I carry out the works I am planning on temporarily housing my current fish in a large paddling pool and use the existing all in one pump that I currently have for filtration/aeration. I was planning on pumping the current pond water into the paddling pool and then transferring the fish once the paddling pool level is enough. The dimensions of the paddling pool are roughly the same as the pond. Does this sound ok? Also, what are the steps I need to take to reintroduce the fish into the new pond once I'm complete? I understand I need to ensure the water is safe and have a testing kit and dechlorinator but is there anything else I can do to make sure I don't stress my fish?

The place the pond is has a slight incline and I have been reading into how to get the pond level so the water level sits right. To do this do i need to build up from the bottom of the pond or can I just level off where the top of the liner will sit and not worry about the excavated part being deeper at the bottom?

I was planning on getting a Flexiliner pond liner and underlay from pondkeeper.co.uk but I can't see anything to say what the liner is made of so I'm a bit worried about the quality. Should I stretch to an EPDM liner or has anyone had any experience of the Flexiliner? When it comes to fitting the liner, is it a case of layering up the underlay and then positioning and folding the liner until its nice and flat?

Lastly (I think!), electrics. I have my current pump plugged into an outside socket. I will need 4 sockets for the pump/UV/outdoor lights etc. My plan is to buy and outdoor extension and plug that into the outside socket and then run my cables underground and into the extension. Does anyone know if this is ok in regards to electrical rules? I would much prefer to have a dedicated switch box for my pond stuff and then keep the sockets seperate for outdoor lights but I'm not sure how I can get a 2nd electrical supply outside? I'm happy to pay for an electrician to do this if necessary. Another complication is that the nearest interior wall where a supply could be ran from is all tiled so not an easy job to fish cables etc!

If anyone can give me some pointers or things to look out for it would be much appreciated! I've read a lot of threads and haven't found the answers to my specifics but if I've repeated any regular questions then I apologise.

Thanks

Re pump; imo, I'd get (2) pumps for redundancy, they'd each be 4K l/ph. The general rule is 1-1/2 times your pond volume per hour.

Your temp housing plan should work just fine. Keep the new water and old as close in temperature as you can. If both are outside, that will insure that. Your new water/pond will be in NPS, which means you'll not have the biofilm that exists on the old liner to help you out. I'd dig, expand, finish, fill, put in plants, then wait 2 weeks. THEN I'd add 4 of your fish to help the cycle establish. You can get a liquid test kit and monitor the ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates (the cycle I spoke of) and you'll know when the rest can go in but even then, I'd go slower with introducing them back. Do a few at a time so your bacteria colonies can keep up with the increased bioload. Bacteria always lags ammonia production.

I'd dig and use the soil as a berm on the low side as then you'll have material to work with for any leveling.

Use EPDM and underlayment, or HDRPE without.

Keep all your electrics waterproof, be they underground or above. You should not need a UV, so there's one more socket to use. UV is a temporary solution and once you've killed the free floating algae, what then? It just dies (along with other, good pond components) and lays on the bottom ready for the next wave of algae to eat it. Use plants and bog filtration to keep your water nice and clear and healthy. I don't know the codes there in the UK, but if you run cable, I'd put it in conduit (outdoor) and bury it where you will not be digging anytime soon. Many have run outdoor extension cords, especially temporarily. Tie all your outdoor plugs into GFCI as that will help protect you and the pond. If you're going to run another line, you'll just have to figure a way to get through the tile (it can be done; if you're hiring an electrician, they can do it for you.)

 

[sterobbo99]

Re pump; imo, I'd get (2) pumps for redundancy, they'd each be 4K l/ph. The general rule is 1-1/2 times your pond volume per hour.

Your temp housing plan should work just fine. Keep the new water and old as close in temperature as you can. If both are outside, that will insure that. Your new water/pond will be in NPS, which means you'll not have the biofilm that exists on the old liner to help you out. I'd dig, expand, finish, fill, put in plants, then wait 2 weeks. THEN I'd add 4 of your fish to help the cycle establish. You can get a liquid test kit and monitor the ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates (the cycle I spoke of) and you'll know when the rest can go in but even then, I'd go slower with introducing them back. Do a few at a time so your bacteria colonies can keep up with the increased bioload. Bacteria always lags ammonia production.

I'd dig and use the soil as a berm on the low side as then you'll have material to work with for any leveling.

Use EPDM and underlayment, or HDRPE without.

Keep all your electrics waterproof, be they underground or above. You should not need a UV, so there's one more socket to use. UV is a temporary solution and once you've killed the free floating algae, what then? It just dies (along with other, good pond components) and lays on the bottom ready for the next wave of algae to eat it. Use plants and bog filtration to keep your water nice and clear and healthy. I don't know the codes there in the UK, but if you run cable, I'd put it in conduit (outdoor) and bury it where you will not be digging anytime soon. Many have run outdoor extension cords, especially temporarily. Tie all your outdoor plugs into GFCI as that will help protect you and the pond. If you're going to run another line, you'll just have to figure a way to get through the tile (it can be done; if you're hiring an electrician, they can do it for you.)

Hi thanks for the reply. I've had a bit more of a read today and I am planning on using one of my existing outdoor sockets to feed a 5 gang switch box for all the pond electrics/lights. I'm going to bury and conduit my cabling also.

I have read a few posts regarding re-introducing my fish and that confirms what I'd read so I will do it nice and slowly. I guess the fish will all be ok in the paddling pool for a few weeks?

I like the sound of a bog filter but I just don't think I have the space to make one as far as I can see. I have to keep the size reasonable so I don't overtake the wifes garden space too much! If there are any suggestions for making a small version then I'll take a look and see if it will fit in my space I have.

 

[brokensword]

Hi thanks for the reply. I've had a bit more of a read today and I am planning on using one of my existing outdoor sockets to feed a 5 gang switch box for all the pond electrics/lights. I'm going to bury and conduit my cabling also.

I have read a few posts regarding re-introducing my fish and that confirms what I'd read so I will do it nice and slowly. I guess the fish will all be ok in the paddling pool for a few weeks?

I like the sound of a bog filter but I just don't think I have the space to make one as far as I can see. I have to keep the size reasonable so I don't overtake the wifes garden space too much! If there are any suggestions for making a small version then I'll take a look and see if it will fit in my space I have.

(whispering, so your wife can't hear) tell her you're going to put in MORE garden for her, and it'll be a 'wet' version (aka the bog!) that she can plant NEW plants in! Imagine her face when you show her pics of water iris, Louisiana gamecock iris, cardinal flower, water hibiscus, sensitive plant, yellow and blue flag iris, monkey flower, arrow plant and even annuals like impatients! Then, tell her she can also have texture as well as color in the form of creeping jenny, water mint, Egyptian papyrus (dwarf), horsetail, rushes, grasses, and more! Tall, large leaf black taro, water canna and water hyacinth! I mean, it'll turn her head so fast she'll probably make you get started on it right away!

See, a bog isn't just great for the pond (and you as in NO maintenance other than thinning plants occasionally) it's also a great NEW type of garden project!

Seriously, ya gots ta sell it, mate!

Re the fish; just make sure you DON'T feed that much and have lots of water movement, half cover the surface with floating plants, and you should be fine. Put a light layer of pea gravel on the bottom for denitrifying bacteria to colonize (mimics the bog idea).

 

[sterobbo99]

(whispering, so your wife can't hear) tell her you're going to put in MORE garden for her, and it'll be a 'wet' version (aka the bog!) that she can plant NEW plants in! Imagine her face when you show her pics of water iris, Louisiana gamecock iris, cardinal flower, water hibiscus, sensitive plant, yellow and blue flag iris, monkey flower, arrow plant and even annuals like impatients! Then, tell her she can also have texture as well as color in the form of creeping jenny, water mint, Egyptian papyrus (dwarf), horsetail, rushes, grasses, and more! Tall, large leaf black taro, water canna and water hyacinth! I mean, it'll turn her head so fast she'll probably make you get started on it right away!

See, a bog isn't just great for the pond (and you as in NO maintenance other than thinning plants occasionally) it's also a great NEW type of garden project!

Seriously, ya gots ta sell it, mate!

Re the fish; just make sure you DON'T feed that much and have lots of water movement, half cover the surface with floating plants, and you should be fine. Put a light layer of pea gravel on the bottom for denitrifying bacteria to colonize (mimics the bog idea).

Ha ha I like your style! I have mentioned it but she isn't really convinced unfortunately. It would be a tight squeeze to fit the pond we want and still have access to the borders etc anyway without then adding a bog. Also, the slope that the pond is positioned on will limit where we can place a bog also so I think its a bit of a non starter unfortunately!

Yeah I was planning on pea gravel at the bottom anyway, more to make it better on the eye but nice to know it also does some good too.

Thanks so much for your replies, it's quite a big undertaking for me this so having a bit of reassurance is great.

 

[brokensword]

Take your wife to a pond club/tour and give her a taste of what COULD happen. I think if she gets the bug, you'll have clearance. The idea is to try and incorporate any bog type structure INTO the garden so it's seamless.

 

[Jhn]

Guess you guys don’t go by the better to ask for forgiveness than permission philosophy.

 

[addy1]

Guess you guys don’t go by the better to ask for forgiveness than permission philosophy.

I just tell hubby, I told you about it dear don't you remember?

 

[Jhn]

I just tell hubby, I told you about it dear don't you remember?

Haha, that wouldn’t fly with my wife. I just go with sorry I thought I told you the plan. She pulls that on me though, but adds on of course you don’t remember cause you weren’t paying attention when I was explaining it to you.

 

[sterobbo99]

I know I've been quiet after my initial questions but we have completed our pond this weekend! It all went pretty smoothly tbh. I made a small error in setting my surface skimmer a bit low so the water level wasn't high enough but luckily I had left extra liner under the skimmer faceplate so could pack under it to raise it. Also, our 1st attempt at a waterfall was an epic fail, all the water ran straight under the rocks rather than over them. A can of waterfall foam later and all was good. The only slight issue I am having is that I have had a fair few fish get stuck in the skimmer box. It is mainly some small golden rudd and shubunkins but i have had a couple of bigger fish in there too. Is this something that they will get used to and stop doing or am I going to have to add a grate of some sort to try and stop it happening?

Just a quick thank you to the people who gave me a few pointers and put my mind at rest