koiguy1969
GIGGETY-GIGGETY!!
i gotta go get what i need for spawn mops....i cant tell you how many fry i flushed out of my filter last year...looked like i swept up the floor at a opague plastic grinder.
Fry progress report
- Thread starter jameskoi
- Start date
Good stuff guys.
All I can say is, it's pretty easy raising fry until some sort of plague hits.
I think the hardest challenge for me is what to cull. I'm planning on keeping 50-100 good ones if that is even statistically possible. I'll let them grow as big as they can to compromise my poor culling abilities. I don't expect big pond to suffer plagues due to over population. lol
All I can say is, it's pretty easy raising fry until some sort of plague hits.
I think the hardest challenge for me is what to cull. I'm planning on keeping 50-100 good ones if that is even statistically possible. I'll let them grow as big as they can to compromise my poor culling abilities. I don't expect big pond to suffer plagues due to over population. lol
The cotton mops are in the pond here. But I do not expect a spwan for almost another month according to what the weather does. Definitely need more sunshine and heat. I see plenty of eggs in the bellies. But for the natural spawn to happen the weather needs to cooperate.
The culling is definitely the hardest part. I hate killing fish when they do not have physical defects. But this next year I will only keep dark butterfly Koi and maybe ones with lighter color heads. Mine usually will change in to dark blue or dark bronw. Or maybe a dark mix of Orange and Black. They are hard to see in most ponds. So I will probably cull much earlier on the dark fry so I do not get attached to any of them.
The culling is definitely the hardest part. I hate killing fish when they do not have physical defects. But this next year I will only keep dark butterfly Koi and maybe ones with lighter color heads. Mine usually will change in to dark blue or dark bronw. Or maybe a dark mix of Orange and Black. They are hard to see in most ponds. So I will probably cull much earlier on the dark fry so I do not get attached to any of them.
Don't you just love Indiana weather Randy :lol:
This weather sucks! I hope we get 5 more days of rain this week. Oh yeah.. That's the forecast!
sissy
sissy
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and your wish comes true again .Watch what you wish for
Went out today and my goldfish have spawned in my new water hyacinths plants..exciting.
There are probably cannibals in the 130G now. 90% of the fry that are black or have black patches are big or BIGGER. The white ones are small or really small. I guess all those would likely be kohakus.
In a few more days I will dump all the fry from the 60G into the 130G. I would do right now but I won't just to be safer or wait a week until ammonia levels drop back to zero... It just went through 5 doses of proform-c just to make sure the costia got zapped (ended monday morning). Ammonia started to raise after 3rd treatment. I am now convinced proform-c does harm bio filter. The 60G is fine now after some death. No more flashing and no more dying as far as I can tell.
I will put the white ones into the 60G. The hard work will begin soon. Not sure how to cull yet... I want them to grow bigger to make sure.
130G which still looks like 2000 fry are doing great!
In a few more days I will dump all the fry from the 60G into the 130G. I would do right now but I won't just to be safer or wait a week until ammonia levels drop back to zero... It just went through 5 doses of proform-c just to make sure the costia got zapped (ended monday morning). Ammonia started to raise after 3rd treatment. I am now convinced proform-c does harm bio filter. The 60G is fine now after some death. No more flashing and no more dying as far as I can tell.
I will put the white ones into the 60G. The hard work will begin soon. Not sure how to cull yet... I want them to grow bigger to make sure.
130G which still looks like 2000 fry are doing great!
I think it's 2 months now and here are 3 pictures to post.
This is the 2nd time I sorted fry (haven't culled yet). It appears the all potential ones are the smallest ones. Some are still under 1cm long. My fry are slow growers. I'm good at growing 4-5" koi to 22" in a little over 2 years but I can't grow fry fast at all. lol... Even the 1 or two super tobies are only 1" long. hhahah
Blue bowl are all the rejects. I'm going to give most of them away tomorrow.
The clear bowl are the keepers. Nothing much to see. No colour but some patterns forming and only some are developing a bit of metallic shine. Kept indoors with fluorescent lights.
I think I'm down to 1000 fry now but I think I'm only keeping 200. I kept saying I had 2000+ fry even after experiencing massive die off multiple times. Finally, I'm reporting less. I lose about a dozen a day but most of them were deformed or just too weak to fight off parasites. Some just stop swimming because their backs got too crooked. Some of the them have tails bent so much, it points towards their head and as a result died. Weird...
Costia are relentless little buggers. They kept coming back and I had no choice but to treat them with proform-c on 3 separate occasions.
Big lesson learned - fry always find a way to get sucked up by my water pump. I did so many little tweaks from nylon sock, old fish net and now window curtain. Initially, wrapped the whole entire water pump. No matter how careful, there is always a gap or a hole. Wrapped fish net around vented areas only with lots of rubber bands. Thought that was great idea. It won't clog as fast as nylon but fry still found a way to get sucked up. I don't know how since I can't find the gap or hole. Who knows how many more died. What I did at the end was remove the water pump cap/lid and wrapped the whole fabric from the inside and then tie it off from the outside and put it cap/lid back on (see 3rd pic). Now, as long as it's capped, no fish will get sucked in. I wish I thought of that sooner. Depending on how fine material to use, no fry should ever get sucked in any more, even on day one. May need to clean external part of water pump more often with finer material. I reckon if use more material to provide more surface area, it'll clog later rather than sooner too.
Pic 1 is the GOOD bowl. These are the fry I want to raise longer.
Pic 2 is blue bowl that I don't want - giving most away tomorrow and the rest later.
Overall, an interesting experience. Was hoping to get at least 100 good ones but I think if I end up with 5 good ones out of 1000 live fry, it is a job well done.
This is the 2nd time I sorted fry (haven't culled yet). It appears the all potential ones are the smallest ones. Some are still under 1cm long. My fry are slow growers. I'm good at growing 4-5" koi to 22" in a little over 2 years but I can't grow fry fast at all. lol... Even the 1 or two super tobies are only 1" long. hhahah
Blue bowl are all the rejects. I'm going to give most of them away tomorrow.
The clear bowl are the keepers. Nothing much to see. No colour but some patterns forming and only some are developing a bit of metallic shine. Kept indoors with fluorescent lights.
I think I'm down to 1000 fry now but I think I'm only keeping 200. I kept saying I had 2000+ fry even after experiencing massive die off multiple times. Finally, I'm reporting less. I lose about a dozen a day but most of them were deformed or just too weak to fight off parasites. Some just stop swimming because their backs got too crooked. Some of the them have tails bent so much, it points towards their head and as a result died. Weird...
Costia are relentless little buggers. They kept coming back and I had no choice but to treat them with proform-c on 3 separate occasions.
Big lesson learned - fry always find a way to get sucked up by my water pump. I did so many little tweaks from nylon sock, old fish net and now window curtain. Initially, wrapped the whole entire water pump. No matter how careful, there is always a gap or a hole. Wrapped fish net around vented areas only with lots of rubber bands. Thought that was great idea. It won't clog as fast as nylon but fry still found a way to get sucked up. I don't know how since I can't find the gap or hole. Who knows how many more died. What I did at the end was remove the water pump cap/lid and wrapped the whole fabric from the inside and then tie it off from the outside and put it cap/lid back on (see 3rd pic). Now, as long as it's capped, no fish will get sucked in. I wish I thought of that sooner. Depending on how fine material to use, no fry should ever get sucked in any more, even on day one. May need to clean external part of water pump more often with finer material. I reckon if use more material to provide more surface area, it'll clog later rather than sooner too.
Pic 1 is the GOOD bowl. These are the fry I want to raise longer.
Pic 2 is blue bowl that I don't want - giving most away tomorrow and the rest later.
Overall, an interesting experience. Was hoping to get at least 100 good ones but I think if I end up with 5 good ones out of 1000 live fry, it is a job well done.
Attachments
So exactly what is your selection criteria for;
1 keepers
2 give away
3 cull
It is always interesting to hear what others are doing. I generally wait until they are at least an inch or longer before I sort mine. Then I still don't cull. I offer the less desireable ones to folks who cannot afford to buy but want Koi.
The big breeders in Japan are very closed lipped about their culling selection process. I don't really understand why but they are. We have a large Koi farm nearby who has his roots in the family business in Japan. He would not talk about it at all.
My fry are still in a large Tote and because of the nature of the tote and the plant life in it, mine are difficult to study at this time. I chose to do it this year as an experiment to see if the colors would prove to be better if grown where UV (from the sun) and a more natural environment enters into the equation.
1 keepers
2 give away
3 cull
It is always interesting to hear what others are doing. I generally wait until they are at least an inch or longer before I sort mine. Then I still don't cull. I offer the less desireable ones to folks who cannot afford to buy but want Koi.
The big breeders in Japan are very closed lipped about their culling selection process. I don't really understand why but they are. We have a large Koi farm nearby who has his roots in the family business in Japan. He would not talk about it at all.
My fry are still in a large Tote and because of the nature of the tote and the plant life in it, mine are difficult to study at this time. I chose to do it this year as an experiment to see if the colors would prove to be better if grown where UV (from the sun) and a more natural environment enters into the equation.
Right now, I think it is easy to sort my koi. There are really only two types. Ones that are all black and some with pattern. Virtually no all whites or yellow. I still have a few yellow tanchos with black heads. Maybe those will become real tanchos. I don't know. The pictures above I posted came from 130G which already went through 1st sort. Even more turned black or have become darker.
I never culled before and from what I read on the www, someone with black ones kept them and raised it (I think it came from this forum) and just ended up having too many bigger black ones. I wish there were lots of reading material about culling. I can't seem to find any on the www.
I kept a few black ones just in case. I think I'm going to go collect a few more before I give the ones I currently don't want away.
BTW, I did another water pump mod. I have a rubber band to wrap around the tiny latch. It's a tiny slit where the cup/lid fits snugly into the main assembly. Since I have fabric wrapped around the cup/lid, it doesn't latch on properly. Some babies got inside again. haha..
BTW2, just taking a guess - 50% of the current ones I want to give away more or less have deformities. Maybe that ratio is higher. I have some that look like moby dick, some with a hump on the back and anything in between. I expected deformities, but not this many!
I never culled before and from what I read on the www, someone with black ones kept them and raised it (I think it came from this forum) and just ended up having too many bigger black ones. I wish there were lots of reading material about culling. I can't seem to find any on the www.
I kept a few black ones just in case. I think I'm going to go collect a few more before I give the ones I currently don't want away.
BTW, I did another water pump mod. I have a rubber band to wrap around the tiny latch. It's a tiny slit where the cup/lid fits snugly into the main assembly. Since I have fabric wrapped around the cup/lid, it doesn't latch on properly. Some babies got inside again. haha..
BTW2, just taking a guess - 50% of the current ones I want to give away more or less have deformities. Maybe that ratio is higher. I have some that look like moby dick, some with a hump on the back and anything in between. I expected deformities, but not this many!
I have used sun screen material that I bought at Home Depot. My wife sewed them into tubes so the open end could either go around a pump or an intake tube for an aquarium filter. It works very well and does not have to be cleaned as often as a nylon sock.
Sounds like a great method!
Only wish I rigged something robust since day 1. All those quick fix ideas and time spent tweaking caused 1000+ to die. Oh well... Live and learn. hehe
Only wish I rigged something robust since day 1. All those quick fix ideas and time spent tweaking caused 1000+ to die. Oh well... Live and learn. hehe
It took 2 years of nylon socks before I used innovation to improve what turned into something better. That is the beauty of this hobby. Necessity is the mother of invention.