Filtration with Matala

[Alonso]

I have a 4000 gal pond and built an above ground multichamber filtration system using 55 gallon plastic barrels. The first chamber is a vortex filter. In the second I tightly installed brushes for mechanical filtration. In the third and fourth barrels I placed matala pads, one of each density cut to fit tightly in the barrel to avoid water bypassing the media. My idea is to use the matala pads as mechanical and biological filtration media. Each barrel has a cone shaped bottom to drain sedimented solids. One pump inyects water from the bottom of the pond to the vortex and a second pump sends water back to the pond via a waterfall.
The pond has been running for about two weeks with 7 small koi (4-9 inch). About 5 dias ago the water started to get cloudy. I drained and cleaned the first three chambers and only flushed the bottom from the fourth barrel in order to avoid disturbing the bacteria in the media.
How long does it take for matala pads to mature biologically?
How often should I rinse the media to avoid clogging without affecting the bacteria in it?
The shmuck form the pond seems to be pulverized by the first pump when it reaches the vortex and even the high density black matala pad lets through some particles and this isn't helping water clarity....
What do I need to do to?

 

[davepratt]

ponds only been up and running for 2 weeks i prolly wouldnt be messing with anything that baby needs time to cycle at least a month or two heck you prolly aint even had an algae bloom yet haha you have to be patient and let it run its course did you use any of the liquid bacteria when you started it to get the cycle rolling??

 

[Alonso]

Indeed I did......but probable not enough, only half a bottle. I've been reading that mother nature is the best source of beneficial bacteria and that they will apear all by themselves

 

[Alonso]

Should I pour it directly to the filter or on the pond? I've been feeding the fish two times a day, they seem always hungry........is it too much?

 

[JohnHuff]

You have a 4000g pond, you have another 220g in your 4x 55g drums. With all that water, you could probably keep a small whale in your pond. You only have 7 small koi. The nitrogen cycle and the bacteria needs ammonia to start. I'm thinking it'll be a while before you get enough ammonia from the 7 small koi to colonize all the pads and brushes in the 3 drums. The liquid bacteria doesn't contain any bacteria, only substrate to get it started.

How long does it take for matala pads to mature biologically?
The consensus is at least 4 weeks for the cycle to complete,

How often should I rinse the media to avoid clogging without affecting the bacteria in it?
You can rinse the media with pond water to avoid killing the bacteria. But with so much media, I'm thinking it will take a while before it all gets clogged. By the by, I'm not a fan of this system as it's quite a pain to clean. You should have a prefilter that is easy to clean to catch all the suspended material so you don't to rip out all the pads to clean. My preferred system is a prefilter before the first pump and moving media in the 3rd and 4th pumps preferably with air. That's what commercial outfits use to clean municipal waste water. And if they can clean municipal waste water, they can clean fish pond water.

 

[JohnHuff]

You're already using 4 barrels: 1 as a settling tank, 1 as a mechanical filter and 2 as bio-filters.
Your brushes should really be the biofilter since they ain't no good as mechanical filters.
And your mats should be mechanical filters since they're better at catching solids.
The one below uses 3 "barrels", but you would only need 2: 1 for biofiltration and a settling tank.

Like this:
http://www.lenntech.com/processes/mbbr.htm

 

[Mmathis]

I thought the brushes were best for mechanical filtration....

 

[Alonso]

Brushes can be mechanical or biological filters. As lon as you rinse them with pond water, they will do the bio fase.

 

[sissy]

fish are always hungrey and feeding them 2 times a day may have caused ammonia to build up .Do you have a test kit .That will tell you the whole story

 

[koiguy1969]

filter brushes are usually one of the first stages in the filtration...their intended purpose is to collect larger debris. absolutely every surface in the filtration will allow for colonization of bacterias. but the surface area of brushes is minimal,and in most systems, likely of little consequence biologically.

 

[Mucky_Waters]

I have a 4000 gal pond and built an above ground multichamber filtration system using 55 gallon plastic barrels. The first chamber is a vortex filter. In the second I tightly installed brushes for mechanical filtration. In the third and fourth barrels I placed matala pads, one of each density cut to fit tightly in the barrel to avoid water bypassing the media. My idea is to use the matala pads as mechanical and biological filtration media. Each barrel has a cone shaped bottom to drain sedimented solids. One pump inyects water from the bottom of the pond to the vortex and a second pump sends water back to the pond via a waterfall.
The pond has been running for about two weeks with 7 small koi (4-9 inch). About 5 dias ago the water started to get cloudy. I drained and cleaned the first three chambers and only flushed the bottom from the fourth barrel in order to avoid disturbing the bacteria in the media.
How long does it take for matala pads to mature biologically?
How often should I rinse the media to avoid clogging without affecting the bacteria in it?
The shmuck form the pond seems to be pulverized by the first pump when it reaches the vortex and even the high density black matala pad lets through some particles and this isn't helping water clarity....
What do I need to do to?

How about posting some pictures of your pond and filtration set up. It sounds very similar to mine except I have a bottom drain and gravity feed system, so no "shmuck" gets pulverized.
Here is my Matala pad tank.

I only clean them once a year at the end of the season.

 

[Catfishnut]

Alonso,

My opinion from reading your system description is this... I do not believe that the first stage (the vortex) is doing what you would like it to. If you have made a vortex filter from a 55 gallon barrel with a conical botton, I do not think that that is sufficient volume to make the vortex concept operate effectively. From the information I have read, I believe the vessel would need to be much larger.

Personally, I would keep that first stage - the vortex, but convert it to a radial flow filter instead (you can google all sorts of info on this, expressly from Paul Van Der Werf). The conical bottom would be a benefit when combined into a radial flow filter and I believe it would be much more effective at removing undissolved solid matter than a 55 gallon vortex.

A radial flow filter design is crudely so simple, but works extremely well. You could set it up in just a few hours. The advantage is that the radial flow filter doesn't require the huge water volume like a vortex filter (separator) does.

This would be one step you could take to help improve your existing system without a huge alteration.

There were already some replies with other advice that I also agree with. Such as the moving bed bio-converter media and the fact that you have such a small bio-load at this time that it will take a while to generate a colony of bacteria. If there is little ammonia / nitrogen content, the bacteria won't have anything to live on so why would they move in and set up home there? In relation to this, the bacteria need oxygen, so a moving bed filter using air to create the media movement is a benefit as that not only gets the media moving around, but provides the bacteria with their O2.

You also need to be aware that the bacteria colonies secrete a very thin layer of slime to live in and to attach themselves to the media. If your water going through this media is full of undissolved solids (dirty water) you can basically smother the bacteria cultures if it (the muck) is allowed to build up on the cultures. Just a light coating to our eyes is like a huge, smothering blanket to the bacteria. Best to get that all prefiltered out mechanically before it reaches the bio-conversion units. Here is where the radial flow filter AND the moving bed bio-filter are both going to be positive attributes. The radial flow filter will work very well at separating the muck and the moving bed will assist in knocking off any muck and sludge that might still come through (better yet, it prevents it from building up in the first place) as well as knocking off the older, dead bacteria.

I would probably try to design the system to be:

Prefilter for inlet pump from pond (or better yet, gravity flow if possible) -> Radial Flow Filter -> Moving Bed Filter -> Matala Mat Filter -> (Polishing Filter / UV / Zeolite, etc) -> pump back to pond

Gordy (AKA Catfishnut)

 

[JohnHuff]

Hi:
This is the first time I've ever heard of a radial flow filter, but it's just basically a settlement chamber. I believe a vortex filter, or as Paul Van Der Werf calls it, a swirl filter, would work better. I think a vortex would work in a 55g tank. I think it'd work in any size tank, the taller the better as it gives more time for the solids to settle.

Here's a better radial flow filter.
1) Use a rectangular container. Since there isn't any swirling, the straight sides would make it easier to make watertight.

2) Put a grate in the middle of that and fill it full of bioballs. The solids would still drop to the bottom, but the water welling up would have to go past the bioballs to the exit. So you get a settlement chamber and biofiltration.

3) Even better, put an air hose on top of that grate and use K2 instead and you've got a moving bed filter on top of the settlement chamber. Let's call that the John Van Der Huff filter, lol.

Personally, I would keep that first stage - the vortex, but convert it to a radial flow filter instead (you can google all sorts of info on this, expressly from Paul Van Der Werf). The conical bottom would be a benefit when combined into a radial flow filter and I believe it would be much more effective at removing undissolved solid matter than a 55 gallon vortex.

A radial flow filter design is crudely so simple, but works extremely well. You could set it up in just a few hours. The advantage is that the radial flow filter doesn't require the huge water volume like a vortex filter (separator) does.

Gordy (AKA Catfishnut)

 

[koiguy1969]

radial flow filter.....

 

[koiguy1969]

swirl filter