Chemical vs UV

[Cdsdave]

Wondering what opinions are out there concerning using chemicals vs UV or both together? In particular using Pond Cares Microbial Algae Clean. The info I read says its EPA approved safe, and works in about a month to clear 90% of the algae.

In general are chemicals that claim to be natural or at least fish safe good for ponds with fish?

I've been trying, at the suggestion of our local garden center/pond supply store, Pond Cares Ecofix to clear my pond water. My guess is since my algae is still alive and well it's not effective at clearing the water. The bottle does say it breaks down DEAD algae and increases oxygen levels.

Thanks!!

 

[slakker]

For me neither, I'm going to focus on natural balance of the eco-system. From biological/mechanical filtration to using plants... Not sure if I can do it, as I'm new to ponds myself, but that's the philosophy I use in reef aquariums.

 

[sissy]

same here neither .Not in 9 years almost first year I did try 2 things and then read the bottle after that nothing. That was in my first preformed pond .Plus the cost ,I am cheap .

 

[crsublette]

Choosing chemicals or UV depends on the context. They each have their own unique role and neither are the final solution to it all.

There are many oxidizers that are natrually created in nature, but they are created at such of a low concentration that it is not noticeable. Concentration is what determines if something is "less" natural or not. Arsenic, for example, is produced quite naturally in our ponds in very low concentrations, but it is extremely deady when we manufacture it to be at much higher concentrations.

Algae products, like the one you mentioned, are either sometype of oxidizer or microbicide, but I don't know anything about that particular product. These products are safe as long as instructions are properly followed to the letter and you absolutely better be accurate on your pond's gallons. And, No, I do not need to use every single pond product on the shelf to know whether or not it is a good product.


Everything in nature is not candyland and carebears. There's some nasty stuff allowed to happen even in healthy water.

Nature takes years and decades to properly establish it self due to all of the microorganisms and natural antibiotics that are created. Yet, we dig a hole, fill it up with water, put some plants and fish in it, and think Nature will only do good things for us.


Just be careful with many of those pond stores products. They are there just to sell ya something and not necessarily to help ya. They might not be selling a disasterous product, but some of these pond store products are close to it.

Also, I rarely trust the marketing on the products.

Some pond store products are like those really weird food diets or weird exercise equipment you always see on the television at like 3am or late at night.

 

[Waterbug]

Bacteria scam
If you read the Material Safety Data Sheet for any chemical product you will get the actual answer, not the marketing say whatever we want to sell stuff. Thanks to government regulations sellers could be in serious trouble lying on the MSDS while it's perfectly OK to say anything they like any other place.

For Pond Cares Ecofix the MSDS basically says the product is not known to be harmful because it hasn't been tested at all. So that's like saying it's safe to jump off a 10 story building because we haven't done any tests telling us otherwise. Reading further you will see that what they consider to be the active ingredient is 0.05% bacteria. Note that they don't give the specific species of bacteria because they have no idea. There have been a few sellers over the years that did actually try to culture a specific species, but that's not really needed to sell products. If you filled a bottle with normal pond water my guess is the amount of bacteria in the water would be about 0.05%. The largest number of cells in the human body aren't human, it's bacteria.

I assume that is exactly what Ecofix is, pond water. They certainly don't say its anything different. The scam works because people can't believe sellers could get away with selling pond water to pond owners...they sure can and have for years.

Another certain way to spot a scam is when they say it takes weeks to work. Most people will buy more because it hasn't worked "yet". First rule in cons is once you find a sucker you milk them. Secondly many ponds will clear on their own after a few weeks. That gives the sellers lots and lots of testimonials from happy buyers who will swear until the cows come home that the product is great. You will find pond forums full of such happy users who "know" their pond cleared because of the product they were smart enough to buy.

It's typical for these products to say "breaks down DEAD algae" because that is what bacteria do, including the bacteria everyone already has in their pond. The "increases oxygen levels" is just a lie imo, but I assume they could say that while the algae is being broken down by the bacteria O2 is lower, that later, because the decay process is over O2 levels would rise again. Where I come from that kind of silly word spinning is called a lie. On Wallstreet they call it marketing. People just like to hear "increase O2" because they think that's a good thing. People also like to hear "breaks down DEAD algae" because they think that's a good thing, but actually that is the very process that is bad for fish. Live algae is very good for fish. Dead algae by itself doesn't harm fish. It's the break down of algae that causes problems. The elements consumed in the process and released do fish no favors, though they can handle most cases just fine. And the process also allows bacteria to reproduce. The bacteria in question is most often the same kind referred to as "flesh eating bacteria", being the most common by far. Not really that good imo.

It's a sweet scam. Used by tons of pond products and happily sold by lots of complicit retailers. I've never heard of anyone ever holding any retailer accountable for such fraud so crime does in fact pay.

Effective chemicals.
There are chemicals which are very effective against algae, and they are "safe". The term "safe" means the fish will not be killed directly (like within 72 hours of using the product) when the product is used as directed. As in it's "safe" to sit in a running car in a closed garage for some period of time. Exceed that time and you would die. And of course you may have brain damage but you are still alive, so it's "safe". Reading the MSDS will explain it all in detail.

UV is 100% effective 100% of the time when installed, sized and maintained properly. UV is considered 100% safe although with any electrical device there are risks.

 

[dieselplower]

2 great posts and now ill just pat myself on the back for not pouring anything into my pond hahaha

 

[Cdsdave]

Thanks Charles and Waterbug for your input!! I want to avoid manufactured pond chemicals as much as possible and am fine with going the UV route to get rid of the pea soup!

It makes me think of all the chemicals we put in our bodies, be it vitamins, or preservatives from processed foods. We just don't know what these things are going to do to us in the long run. I want to keep my pond friends happy and healthy!!

 

[HTH]

UV is great.but there are two cases that should be mentioned.

If the algae is there because of a large nutrient supply adding the UV kill the algae that is now consuming the nutrients.

If the algae is there because the bio filter is too small or not fully cycled adding the UV will kill the algae and you will see ammonia and or nitrite levels rise.

Adding the UV in either case will result in a less healthy pond even if the water is clearer. Some would even argue that if you can eliminate both problems you will not need the UV. I am not saying that, but please be aware that you need to monitor the water when you add a UV in a pond with algae problems.

 

[pecan]

I too have never done either, only biological filtration and plant roots. I attribute it to my being cheap and lazy but it has worked.

 

[Jason]

The first Pond I built was only around 125 Gallons
[sharedmedia=gallery:images:3405]
[sharedmedia=gallery:images:3404]
It looks nice and clear in this picture but after a few months one day I walked out to feed the fish and There was sludge everywhere and the next few days and algae bloom occurred and I did not know how to stop it without adding chemicals and that's when I turned to you wonderful people
I ripped up the pond and rebuilt it around 500 gallons and bought a 13w UV Filter that has been up and running for almost 9 months with 0 algae
NEW:
[sharedmedia=gallery:images:2817]
CURRENT:

[sharedmedia=gallery:images:3042]
But at the same time, I have never used a good amount of plants in the pond so I would go with either or, or both

 

[Citizen arcane]

I encounter green algal bloom in the spring months when the pond is "waking up." For this I turn my UV sterilizer on around the first of March (live in zone 9) and off about six weeks later, haven't any problems with green water since.

If your algae is brown, then that's diatoms and not sure if UV will help. Diatoms usually occur in new aquaria and will go away once the filtration is balanced. Other blooms occur due to excess light (which you can't control other than covering 2/3 of the surface area w/ plants) nitrates (water changes) and phosphates (heavily plant the pond.) HTH.

 

[Giese48]

I rarely trust the marketing on the products.

 

[JohnHuff]

I'd use neither. The algae are there because there are nutrients. Get rid of the nutrients and you'll get rid of the algae. Get rid of the algae when there are still nutrients in the pond and there'll be trouble.

I use mechanical filtration to remove free floating algae. They'll have served their purpose by soaking up nutrients. More algae will grow and I'll do the same knowing that I've removed nitrogen and carbon from the pond.

To soak up or get rid of nutrients otherwise, I'll do water changes and/or add plants. I've been adding duckweed and then removing them when they get too plentiful.