Beautiful weather- dead koi

mrsclem

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Today is turning out to be a really bad day. Took a nasty fall last night so not able to get around. I happened to look out the window and saw something orange floating in my gin rin pond. I sent hubby down and sure enough it was my largest gin rin - Momma GR. Water temp was 81* yesterday and everybody was fine and more hungry than usual. We had a small storm last night. The lilies are starting to really grow and bloom and the green water was finally going away and then this!
I can't get down there so had hubby pull her out. No sign of injury but 5 other largest koi are in front of the weir for the Savio- Low O2! I had him flush filters and do a 20% water change, and added an air pump. I guess I need to show someone how to do water testing but the ponds are 95% my job. I was sick that I could not get down there but hoping for the best. I looked thru my koi health books and figure a combination of hot humid weather, storm, plant growth and algae die off did in my fishy. If anybody else can figure something different, please let me know.
 

Mmathis

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So sorry to hear about your koi AND your accident! Hope you're recovering from your fall!

So, after Hubby did the filter cleaning, etc., did you notice any difference/improvement in their behavior?

Sounds like you might have a good handle on it, already, though I'm far from being the expert on this. I'm assuming that nothing significant has changed recently....? Could something have washed into the pond with the rainfall?

I would be curious to see what your water tests look like.

Best wishes!
 

mrsclem

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Thanks Turtle Mommy- Still have one koi hanging out in the weir but the rest are swimming around. I racked my brain as to what happened. I have 2 ponds but the are very different. one is 2'-4' deep with lilies and the other is 5'deep with no plants in the pond but window boxes with plants and water flowing thru. Hubby thought maybe she was egg bound but that would not explain the others at the surface. Hoping to be able to get down there tomorrow and do some testing.
 

j.w

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Darn that's too bad about your big mama koi and sorry you hurt yourself. Hope the other fish will be fine and you also.
 
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Hope you are feeling better very soon after your fall and sorry about your koi. Hope you get it figured out and your other fishies are ok.
 
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I know you have only lost the one koi so far but you may want to check this out I've copied it off from my documents for you to read as it does fit the stormy weather you had plus the fish hanging by the water fall . I'd also get your koi scraped looking for flukes both gill and flukes etc :-
Catastrophic Oxygen Depletion Koi pond in your
We are grateful to the dedicated professors and researchers at our universities for their contributions to aquaculture. Because of their hard work and attention to detail, they have given us the information we need to keep our koi ponds and pond fish healthy, so we can enjoy the wonderful past time of pond keeping.
Catastrophic Oxygen Depletion and How to Avoid It
The Indiana ADDL is located on the Purdue Campus in West Lafayette, Indiana.
by: Tim Muench, DVM, MS
Edited by: Randy White,DVM, PhD
During the warm spring and summer months, we receive an increased number of phone calls regarding sudden fish kills in ponds. The typical history includes observing a very large number of fish dead in an otherwise normal pond following a rainstorm or summer thunderstorm. Usually the owner is very concerned that the fish may have died due to "run-off" of farm chemicals into the pond. Most of the time, these fish kills are a result of a phenomenon known as "pond stratification." Pond stratification is somewhat of a misnomer, since the stratification can also occur in lakes, creeks and some rivers. The stratification leads to a catastrophic depletion of oxygen which almost always results in a very high mortality of aquatic animal life within 24-48 hours following the "de-stratification."
The scientific reasoning behind this phenomenon of pond stratification relates to the temperature of the pond. In the early spring, while the temperature of the pond is still relatively low, the dissolved oxygen is uniformly distributed throughout the pond. As the atmospheric temperature increases, the pond begins to stratify, that is, become layered, with the surface water becoming warmer and lighter while the cooler and denser water forms a layer underneath. Circulation of the colder bottom water is prevented because of the difference in densities between the two layers of water. Dissolved oxygen levels decrease in the bottom layer since photosynthesis and contact with the air is reduced. The already low oxygen levels are further reduced through the decomposition of waste products, which settle to the pond bottom. After a rain, or any other event which disrupts the two layers, a "de-stratification" or "turn-over" of the pond occurs. This has the effect of releasing all of the dissolved oxygen from the upper layer of the pond into the atmosphere, hence, a catastrophic oxygen depletion.
Once stratification of a pond occurs, there is nothing that can be done to alleviate the situation. However, pond stratification can be very easily prevented by the use of supplemental aeration. Aerators come in all sizes and shapes as well as different power sources, i.e., tractor p-t-o, electrical, mechanical, etc. It is important to aerate the pond properly, i.e. match the size of the aerator to the pond, since over-aeration is wasted and may even lead to oxygen supersaturation, known as "gas-bubble" disease and under-aeration will not prevent stratification.
In those cases where we suspect catastrophic oxygen depletion, all other possible pathogens including bacterial, viral, parasitic agents are eleminated from the differential diagnosis list. However, the history of several days to weeks of warm weather followed by a sudden rainstorm are highly suggestive of this condition. If you suspect that you are dealing with a pond turn-over situation following pond stratification, it is imperative to have the pond owner take a water sample and have the dissolved oxygen (DO) concentration evaluated immediately. This water sample should be collected in a clean glass jar or bottle with a screw-top lid and should be completely filled by completely submersing the sample and container and placing the lid on the container while it is still under water.
By: Tim Muench, DVM, MS
Edited by: Randy White,DVM, PhD

Hope this helps

Dave
 
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For someone like me who has their pump in the bottom of the pond in the deep end on one side and 2 returns creating a lot of agitation on the other side, would it be fair to say this catastrophic oxygen depletion should not be a problem?

I imagine it would be more of a problem for a person with their pump in a skimmer so the water on top is constantly drawn off and the water at the bottom could remain more undisturbed...
 

mrsclem

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Thanks for the info Dave. I have several books on koi health and went to those yesterday in search of answers. The Tetra Encyclopedia of Koi stated the following
"Insufficient oxygen in the water causes koi to stop feeding and become lethargic, with stressed fish often seen at the surface. Such stress not only has direct physical effects but also makes the fish more susceptible to 'opportunistic' parasites and disease organisms. In a pond with low oxygen levels, the morning after a humid summer night may see the largest fish floating lifelessly on the surface."
Keeping plant levels to a minimum and adding a second pump to increase aeration is You can never stop learning in life-
Will test this am and post results. Thanks to everybody
 

addy1

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Darn mrsclem...........hope you feel better and you lose no more fish
 

mrsclem

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Tested the water and I was shocked to see the results-
ammonia- .75 (after a water change)
nitrite- .25
ph- 7.5
O2- 5mg/l
With a water temp of 76* o2 level should be above 8.
I added a 2nd air pump and treated with ammonia reducer. will test again in a couple of hours.
 

TgM

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Would 2 air stones at the deepest part of a pond be the best defense against stratification?

I'd think so, a pump would be best until there's a issue w a leak and possible drained pond.


&mrsclem get to feeling better soon!
 

mrsclem

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Now have 3 air stones running ( plus one in other pond)
Tested again at 1pm.
ammonia .25
nitrites- .25
ph- 7.5
oxygen- 5
going to do another small water change later but all fish are swimming around acting fine.
 

mrsclem

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That's ok Diesel- happens to me all the time, write a post, hit enter and nothing!
Retested ammonia at 3:30. Almost at zero!!! Still doing another water change and I can see the bottom of the pond. I'm sure in a couple of days I'll have green water again but oh well- Guessing the Microbe-lift ammonia reducer did some good.
 

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